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Not finding anything for Margaret, but a possible for Jane in 1871? But she has no children.

Thomas Woodruff
Age:44
Estimated birth year:abt 1827
Relation:Head
Gender:Male
Where born:Salford
Civil Parish:Salford
Ecclesiastical parish:Holy Trinity
County/Island:Lancashire
Country:England
Registration district:Salford
Sub-registration district:Greengate
ED, institution, or vessel:11
Household schedule number:200
Piece:4017
Folio:68
Page Number:34
Household Members:
Name
Age
Thomas Woodruff 44 (widow)
Jane Woodruff 29 <<20 on image
Mary Ann Woodruff 16
John Woodruff 15
William Morris 18

Thomas appears to have dropped 5 years off his age in 1881 and is with new wife Mary Ann.

Hi Flip,

Yes - I have Mark + Margaret's marriage cert and I have Mary Jane's birth cert which shows her mother as Jane Fenton formerly Woodroffe.

Thanks Ginns - I will see if I can follow 'that' Margaret through now..........

Dea x

Dea

You may have seen this?



1871 England Census


Name:Margaret Fenton

Age:19

Estimated birth year:abt 1852

Relation:Niece

Gender:Female

Where born:Bolton, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish:Thornton

County/Island:Lancashire

Registration districtFylde

Sub-registration district:Poulton le Fylde

ED, institution, or vessel:17

Household schedule number:9

Piece:4224

Folio:29

Page Number:3

Household Members:


John Pye 37
Dorothy Pye 41
William Pye 77
Margaret Fenton 19
James Pye 4

Dorothy Fenton marries John Pye in 1861. Could Dorothy be related to Mark Fenton?

Dea, do you actually have a copy of the marriage certificate for Mark/Margaret? Also where did the name for Jane come from - was it one of the children's birth certificates?

Thanks all - do you know that in all these years I had never even considered that John and Thomas may have 'belonged' to Jane - It just shows what fresh eyes can bring. :-0 :-D

I will explore that avenue..............

Dea x

Looks like Elizabeth Ellen and an older child were christened with mother named as Jane - so Margaret must have been off the scene earlier than originally thought.


Elizabeth Ellen Fenton
Gender:Female
Baptism Date:7 Jul 1875
Baptism Place:St. Paul's, Paddington, Lancashire, England
Father:Mark Fenton
Mother: Jane Fenton
FHL Film Number:1786419
Reference ID:item 4 p 73

Christened at same church was Mary Ann Fenton, 13/4/1873, with same parents

William/Elizabeth Acton were witnesses when Mark Fenton (21) married on 18/11/1899 to Alice Maycox. Mark also named his father as Mark fenton, stonemason (did not state deceased though)

When Elizabeth Ellen Fenton married William Acton 29/9/1894 she named her father as Mark Fenton, stonemason. They were with John Fenton in 1901 - it looks like Mark died as Fenton in 1896?

Wonder if William Henry was confused.

FS transcribed the m.cert as Lenton:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FMRN-Q5C

Unfortunately, the free images on FS begin at entry with 271:
Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1865
Surname Forename(s) Surname Forename(s) Church / Register Office Registers At Reference
PENDLEBURY Jane MINSHALL Charles Salford St Philip Salford C35/1/271

lan-opc also gives Lenton:
Marriage: 31 Oct 1864 St Philip, Salford, Lancs.
Peter Statham - 46 Stonemason Widower of Temperance St.
Mary Ann Lenton - 46 Widow of Temperance St.
Groom's Father: Jonathan Statham, Stonemason
Bride's Father: William Potter, Sizer
Witness: Henry Jackson; Sarah Jackson, (X)
Married by Banns by: William Hopwood
Register: Marriages 1838 - 1873, Page 118, Entry 236
Source: LDS Film 1408660

Dea


Yoy said that Jane's surname was Woodruffe.


Could this be the registration of John "Fenton"


Births Mar 1871 (>99%)

Woodruffe John Salford 8d 76

I do not know who John and Thomas were, or in deed came from

They were there before

AND - I have npw found an Albert now !!

Dea Xxx

Yes - I had found William Henry and his faher as Statham - Don't know what it means though !!

Dea Xxx

Mark's son's marriage proving he had changed his name. Wonder why he's not recorded as Fenton? Doesn't answer your query though :-S

Marriage: 24 May 1902 St Barnabas, Pendleton, Lancashire, England
William Henry Fenton - 25, Mason, Bachelor, 7 Shuttleworth St
Eliza Hart - 25, Widow, 7 Shuttleworth St
>> Groom's Father: Mark Statham, Mason
Bride's Father: Richard Taylor, Dyer
Witness: Sydney Booth; Phoebe Kingston
Married by Banns by: George Morgan
Register: Marriages 1888 - 1908, Page 167, Entry 334
Source: Microfilm held at Manchester Central Library

Looks like Margaret was off the scene by 1876 going by the mother's name on these baptisms:

Baptism: 4 Jun 1876 St George, Pendleton, Lancashire, England
William Henry Fenton - [Child] of Mark Fenton & Jane
Abode: Edgwick Street
Occupation: Stonemason
Baptised by: E. C. Lethbridge, M.A. Vicar
Register: Baptisms 1872 - 1883, Page 74, Entry 588
Source: Manchester Central Library

Baptism: 2 Oct 1878 St George, Pendleton, Lancashire, England
Mark Fenton - [Child] of Mark Fenton & Jane
Abode: Hedwig St.
Occupation: Stone Mason
Baptised by: E. C. Lethbridge, M.A. Vicar
Register: Baptisms 1872 - 1883, Page 134, Entry 1066
Source: Manchester Central Library

Dea, how do you know that the two elder children on the 1881 census were the issue of Mark and Margaret? Could they be children of Jane's from a previous relationship and now recorded under Mark's name?

I have resurrected this one.

I have been chasing this for about 8 years and have still got no further so would welcome your input on this plaase !

Dea Xxx

Hi,

I didn't want to delete this as those who posted will wonder where it's gone but I am marking it *closed*
as I have had 'yet another long look' at this and it really would be a waste of anyone's time to try to sort it.

I just have to accept that this is one mystery I will never solve.

Many thanks,

Dea x

Sorry for the delay - I couldn't get the info back so have had to look it up again:

1871 Census shows:

Mark Statham
Age: 19
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1852
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Peter
Mother's Name: Mary Ann
Gender: Male
Where born: Broughton, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: Broughton
Ecclesiastical parish: Church of the Ascension
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View Image
Registration district: Salford
Sub registration district: Broughton
ED, institution, or vessel: 2
Household schedule number: 76
Household Members: Name Age
Elizabeth Statham 9
*** .........................Mark Statham 19 mar. - Stone Mason *********
Mary Ann Statham 52
Peter Statham 53
William Statham 16




Source Citation: Class: RG10; Piece: 4013; Folio: 24; Page: 16; GSU roll: 846314.


....................
Had trouble finding the marriage of Mark's mother (Mary Ann) again because Free BMD shows this:

Marriages Dec 1864
Lenton Mary Ann Salford 8d 31
Statham Peter Salford 8d 31 ....

Whereas Lancs BMD shows:

Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1864
Surname Forename(s) Surname Forename(s) Church / Register Office Registers At Reference
STATHAM Peter FENTONE Mary A Salford St Philip Salford C35/1/236

MUST be the correct Mark though?

He IS 'married', but I can find no trace of Margaret, or the two boys!

It is just the 1871 census I need please for Margaret + her children + her death + Mark's marriage to Jane Woodruff / Woodruffe.

Many thanks if anyone can find them.

Dea x

Oops - please bear with me - I have changed computers and have obviously 'lost' some info off my Family Tree Programme - I will look up from my back -up.

On 1871 - I remember Mark ws married and living with his mother's new husband under her 'new name'

I couldn't find Margaret and children.

I SHALL return with the info............

Dea x

If they were married in January 1871 they should be together on the 1871 census, assuming they were in the country. Given Margaret's surname, I wonder if she was Irish. They could have returned to Ireland. Maybe she died there?

Yes Potty - that is the one - and you will note that Thomas and John were born before Mark married Margaret

Dea x

Sorry Margaret - No , I have not found Mark + Margaret on any census - they were not together on 1871 and she was 'gone' before 1881.

Dea x