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Margaret in the 1901, for info:

Name: Margaret M Fox
Age: 1
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1900
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Alfred P
Mother's Name: Louisa G
Where born: Knightwick, Staffordshire, England

Heidi / Eviebeavie,
Thanks so much really, my friend will be so pleased with the info I'm going to look at the two marriages as Alfred Fox's mother was a Bullus so that explains the two cousins William and Alfred, will probably get the two marriage certs to prove it once and for all!

Thanks again

Gail

Eviebeavie

So it could be two weddings or two cousins!

Heidi

Margery born Knightswich Worcestershire and Henry in Birmingham and the ages follow through .

Evie Beavie I feel a visit to chester Records office coming on it's only 40 mins away and i have a pass.

Thanks so much both of you for your help

Gail

IGI

http://www.familysearch.org/eng/search/igi/search_igi.asp


William Allen Wattor Bullus
Spouse: Louise Gardner Holding
Marriage: 28 NOV 1886 St James, Congleton, Cheshire, England
Batch No.: I012583

That's the one we can't access at Ancestry.

I think your two-marriages theory would likely be right.

The one we can't look at would be in a parish record probably, and be the record of a church wedding held after the official one.

Okay, searching general Historical Records at Ancestry for

William Allen Watson Bullus

there's

one died 1858, West Bronwich -- William Allen Watton
one died 1897, Chester, born abt 1860 - William Allen W
one born 1858, West Bromwich - William Allen Walton
one born 1859, West Bromwich - William Allen Walton

marriage in an index I can't access:
William Allen Walton Bullus
to
Louisa Gerdner Holding
- it's in the England & Wales Marriages, 1538 to 1940, which is above my pay grade since I pay only for basic.
Is that the one?

Who can look?

Evie beavie

You are a star!!

That would explain things, now I just have to work out the two marriages! 1884 and 1886.

We have a theory that they have married in 1884 without the blessing of the father of William and then married again in 1886, Williams fatehr was a surgeon an he didn't approve of Louisa from what we can gather and made sure she couldn't get her hands on his money it was left in trust for the granddaughters!

Gail

If this is her, not so close to the marriage, and father not likely Holding:


Births Sep 1863
GARDNER Louisa Birmingham 6d 196

Eviebeavie

The locked thing!

On Ancestry when I search for William Allen Watton Bullus it gives me marriages as normal but then there is a marriage with a lock at the side of it

Gail

Pursuing the Louisa I've been looking at, grandmother Charlotte -- drat, can't find her in 1861.

In 1881:

Name: Louisa Holding
Age: 17
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1864
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: William
Mother's Name: Charlotte
Where born: Birmingham, Warwickshire, England
Civil Parish: West Bromwich

William Holding 44
Charlotte Holding 38
Louisa Holding 17
William F. Holding 15
Henry Holding 13
Elliott J. Holding 6
Charlotte E. Holding 2
Ada Slade 17


Is mother Charlotte a Gardner?

Yes!!!

Marriages Jun 1865
> Gardner Charlotte Aston 6d 331
> Holding William Aston 6d 331
Lloyd Sarah Aston 6d 331
Rohss Arthur Bolton Aston 6d 331


Louisa was born before their marriage. Holding was her mother's husband's name. Given the closeness in time, quite likely he was her father.

Heidi

Margaret is on the 1911 but is shown as Margery and thats what the family always called her, think the 1901 is wrong
Gail

Hi sorry yes I do mean William but the Watton and Watson not sure Nora (Dorothy's full sister is Nora Watton on free bmd) but Dorothy's birth cert shows Watson think someone may just have misheard.

Gail

Heidi

Margaret is the half sister of Dorothy we can't find her birth registration either.

We do have a Willian A W Bullus dying in 1897 aged 36 in Chester, and on 1911 census Alfred and Louisa have been married 13yrs but we are now sure that isn't true as we have the marriage in 1907 and it's the only one for them we can find.

Gail

Heidi - I'm not familiar enough with the quirks of the GRO to know about twins. ;)

Is there a Margaret in the 1911 household, and is she the same age as Henry?

That might also go to my theory about him not being their actual son, and being a relation who was taken in.

What does that mean, "the marriage is locked"?

The Bullus-Holding marriage isn't at FreeBMD, and I can't find it by searching for any of the bits, e.g. by her name, by Bull* ...

You meant William, not Willaim, I assume. And Watton, not Watson?

Eviebeavie. You might have someting there as in 1901 Dorthoy and her sister Nora are shown as Bullers, and are in Devon. Will have a closer look at who they are staying with.
Thanks
Gail

1871

Name: Louise Gardener
Age: 7
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1864
Relation: Granddaughter
Gender: Female
Where born: Birmingham, Warwickshire, England
Civil Parish: Aston

Thomas Gardener 56
Charlotte Gardener 57
Elizabeth Gardener 21
Walter Gardener 22
Jane Gardener 19
Mary Gardener 17
Louise Gardener 7


Louise is Charlotte's granddaughter. Possibly child of an unmarried daughter of Charlotte, father Holding ...

Eviebeavie?Heidi
Sorry took a while kids decided they wanted to ask a thousand things at once.

Right I've look at all those births none seem to fit.

The marriage from 1907 appears to be the right one as thats the area the family lived for many years after 1907.

The marriage in 1884 we have seen that so thought yes! then I came across a marriage with the same names in 1886 in Congleton Cheshire for Willaim Allen Watton Bullus and Louisa Gardiner Holding with both fathers names as Willam( William Bullus in 1881 in West bromwich has a father William) but the marriage is locked.

Any thoughts and thanks
Gail

Gail

Births Dec 1889
Bullus Dorothy Thornhill Newton A. 5b 150


1891

Name: Louisa Bullers
Age: 26
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1865
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: William
Where born: Wandsworth

Civil Parish: Barton St Mary
Town: Gloucester
County/Island: Gloucestershire

William Bullers 30
Louisa Bullers 26
Dorothy Bullers 1
Lucy Bullers 24
Charlotte Gardner 77
Ada Gale 25
Annie Gladwyn 18


Name: Charlotte Gardner
Age: 77
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1814
Relation: Grandmother
Where born: Birmingham



It isn't all *quite* matching up with your info.

I wonder whether Gardner was Louisa's mother's second husband.

Louisa holds on to the Gardner as her middle name/initial in the 1901 census and when she marries. It could have been her father's surname, but she was registered as Holding before their marriage, or one of those situations.