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Simon,

I have sent you his Bancrupcy declaration.


T x

Sure Joy :-)

T x

Yes, I have searched Lancs OPC and been to Preston to look at the records there.
I have found plenty about John but nothing on his parents and why he died penniless.

Hi Tracey,

If still bored - how about this then?

Elsie V Braham born c1893 Bishopstoke Hants.
I am trying to find her marriage to Henry Morris? date unknown and her death date unknown, and any children she might have had.
I have searched through so many records, my eyes need a rest.
Thank you.

Simon,

His Bancruptcy record would be why he died penniless.... he wasn't just a surgeon he was an Apothecary too..... so maybe he made some bad business decisions?

I mean i can imagine back then, medicines were expensive, and if he invested in the things people didn't really need, he might have whittled away his money.


Tracey x

Cliffette,

This is believe is "Elsie V Banham's" birth...

Births Sep 1892 Appleton Elsie Violet Winchester 2c 118

Her sister with the family in 1891.

1891 RG number: RG12 Piece: 937 Folio: 18 Page: 30
Address: 34, Upper Brooks, St Mary Kalender, Winchester County: Hampshire
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
APPLETON, Richard Head Married M 33 1858 Gosport Alverstoke
APPLETON, Annie Wife Married F 23 1868 Bishopstoke
APPLETON, Richard Son M 4 1887 Bishopstoke
APPLETON, Alice M Daughter F 2 1889 Bishopstoke
DUNNING, Ada Visitor Spinster F 14 1877 Bishopstoke

Is Ada Annie's sister?

This is Annie's marriage to Richard.

Marriages Dec 1886
Appleton Richard Winchester 2c 227
Dunning Annie Elizabeth Winchester 2c 227



Tracey x

Hi Tracey,

Yes she is.
Thank you

When did Richard die?

T x

Yes please. See my Charles Siggs thread. Ta :-)

Cliffette

This is Annie's second marriage....

Marriages Sep 1894

Appleton Annie Elizabeth St. Saviour 1d 102
Braham Frederick William J St. Saviour 1d 102

Tracey x

Hi Tracey
Richard Appletons death was 25th June 1891.
Thank you

Cliffette,

You say you've only ever found her as Braham on the census...but here she's clearly Appleton!

1911 RG14PN1767 RG78PN62 RD23 SD2 ED5 SN92
Address: 5 Dover House Haddonhall Street S E County: London
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BRAHAM, Frederick W J Head Married M 42 1869 Gas Company Labourer London Surrey
BRAHAM, Annie Elizabeth Wife Married 16 years F 43 1868 Bishopstoke Hampshire
BRAHAM, Arthur James Son M 14 1897 Messenger Boy Traves Wharf London Surrey
BRAHAM, Charles Edward Son M 12 1899 London Surrey
BRAHAM, Amelia May Daughter F 8 1903 London Surrey
APPLETON, Elsie Violet Stepdaughter Single F 18 1893 Coffee Hand Travers Wharf Winchester Hampshire


Tracey x

Cliffette,

So Elsie and Alice are not full siblings then?

I wonder who is Elsie's father? Could it be Frederick afterall?

Even if Elsie was born at the beginning of the 3rd Qtr, or the end of the 2nd (and registered in the 3rd) The pregnancy would still have been a year long!

Even if he got his wife pregnant immediately before he died, the earliest she could give birth and register a child that would slot into the Sept Qtr is Middle of May (allowing for the 6 weeks grace to register)! that's most def more than 9 months after 25th June 1891 !!

T x

Hi Tracey,

Thank you, think i should have gone to specsavers!
I cant believe i missed it- tut! - as per usual - i always seem to get things wrong.
Thanks

Hi Tracey,

Yep you're right must have been Frederick, then why is she down as Appleton?

Thanks

Cliffette,

She'd have been registered as Appleton because that was Annie legal name at the time. Remembering illegitimate children were frowned up.

I would wager that Elsie's mariage cert states Richard as her father... Elsie probably just didn't do the math? I suppose unless you ask direct questions you just don't realise the truth is there to be seen....

.... i would wager Frederick might not be Elsie's father and that Annie might have had a liason with someone else? Annie didn't marry Frederick for 2 more years, why wait so long when your pregnant with your prospective husbands child?

It's possible only Annie knew the truth?

i'm not too sure where this Morris guy comes into it, memories can sometimes gets confused?

I would wager this is Elsie...

Marriages Dec 1915
Appleton Elsie V Hempston Kingston 2a 1167
Hempston William Appleton Kingston 2a 1167

~~~~
....and children.

Births Dec 1916 Hempston Alfred W Appleton Lambeth 1d 487
Births Mar 1918 Hempston William Appleton Lambeth 1d 377
Births Dec 1919 Hempston Margaret E Appleton Southwark 1d 218

~~~~
This death matches both the married name and her birth year??

Name: Elsie V Hempston
Birth Date: abt 1893
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1956
Age at Death: 63
Registration district: Lewisham
Inferred County: London
Volume: 5d
Page: 45

Tracey x

Thank you Tracey,

I will order marriage cert today.
Thank you for your help, and i still think i'll go to specsavers!!

Margaretx :-D

OK here goes, I have been trying to trace my Great grandfathers parents but having no luck
MY gt grandfather Robert Horan c1858 in Ireland was on the Lancashire 1881 census and married a Catherine Finn in 1881, on the marriage certificate it states Roberts father as Michael Horan deceased, we presume he died in Ireland but up to now no luck with that, can't find out Michaels wifes name so really struggling
any help would be gratefully recieved.
Heather :-S

Heather.

.....is this your man?

Liverpool, Lancashire, England, Catholic Baptisms, 1802-1906
Name: Robert Horan
Birth Date: 15 Apr 1856
Baptism Date: 20 Apr 1856
Parish: Holy Cross
Father's Name: Michael Horan
Mother's name: Mary Devany

Tracey x

hello tracy i could do with a bit of help, i have been looking for some time
for a marriage cert for john hamilton & margaret tully as much as i know
margaret was born st mongo's glasgow .john had somthing to do with
shoemaking i have tried scotlands people without success Ann :-)
birth dates 1838