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Over the year's searching for a birth/baptism for my 3x grt granddad William Crook Born 1820c in Manchester to his Death in 1891 Beswick Manchester age 62.I had actually almost given up looking.I knew that his father was James Crook (occ painter) from his marriage to Hannah Pinnington in 1842 in Manchester.So I knew all of this at leaste :-) But I always had this nagging going on to just keep checking.Then I stumbled upon this: William Croock 15th December 1822, Manchester,with fathers name james,but with occupation WEAVER :-( This James crook married Ellen Lythgo 26th April 1801 Manchester.I don't want to get too Giddy due to james occupation :-( I have found a few children for James & Ellen, but the problem is that the nearest child closest to the marriage is James 1804 :-S ..If anyone feels like proving me wrong,i would welcome any input on james occupation ? and finding other births nearer to 1801..Or if I have the wrong parents entirely :-S :-S

To take a fresh look at your conundrum, what is the earliest record you are certain off? i.e, the marriage or birth of one of his children/grandchildren.

Do you have a BC for a known ancestor giving their mother's name as Pinnington, or was that the 'best fit'?

James Crook
England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
christening: 5 February 1804 CATHEDRAL, MANCHESTER, LANCASHIRE, ENGLAND
father: James Crook
mother: Ellen

John Crook
England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
christening: 3 January 1808 CATHEDRAL, MANCHESTER, LANCASHIRE, ENGLAND
father: James Crook
mother: Ellen

Henry Crooke
England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
christening: 14 March 1802 Manchester, Lancashire, England
residence: Manchester, Lancashire, England
father: James Crooke
mother: Ellen

On William Crooks marriage on 12/1/1863 to Hannah Kay (nee Cutler)her dad James Cutler,William's dad was James a Weaver.
Address for William was 5,Sarah Street as on 1861 census.

Maryb

When William and Hannah married, who were the witnesses?

Any links to family names might help trace the line back.

for our help

Manchester, England, Marriages and Banns, 1754-1930 (Cathedral)

Name: William Crook
Marriage Date: 18 Dec 1842
Parish: Manchester, St Mary, St Denys and St George
Father's name: James Crook
Spouse's Name: Hannah Pinnington
Spouse's Father's Name: James Pinnington
Archive Roll: 708

from image:-

William
Of Full Age
Bachelor
Occupation:- Smith
Address:- Mather St
Father occupation:- Painter

Hannah
Of Full Age
Spinster
no occupation shown
Address:- Pollard Street
Father occupation:- Spinner

Witnesses:- Sarah Pinnington (her mark) and Isaac Bythnell (?? Byttnell)

Cane ...........

How convinced are you that you have the correct marriage?

As TEC also asked ............... do you have a birth certificate for one of the children to prove Hannah's maiden name?

I think both marriages are for the same William Crook.

First wife died and he married another Hannah, on criminal record for his son born 1851 Cornelius it states step mother Hannah.

Maryb.

Mary ...............

it would help if you posted the details, rather than just a synopsis!

It saves time for us having to go and search for where you found the information.



I asked Cane if she was certain sure she had the correct Hannah because I found a record for a William Crook marrying a Hannah In Astley, Lancashire, which is not all that far from Manchester, and as I haven't seen a definite place of birth for William.

The slight problem was that this marriage took place in 1847, and William was apparently under the age of 41, BUT the father was Peter and a weaver

from lancsopc ...........

Marriage: 23 Aug 1847 St Stephen, Astley, Lancashire, England

William Crook - minor, Weaver, Bachelor, Astley Green
Hannah Charlton - full, Spinster, Astley Green
Groom's Father: James Crook, Weaver
Bride's Father: Samuel Charlton, Joiner
Witness: Thomas Charlton; Ellen Charlton
Married by Banns by: Robert Minuitt Off. Min.
Register: Marriages 1843 - 1875, Page 33, Entry 66
Source: LDS Family Search

1861 Census

Name: Hannah Crook
Age: 41
Estimated birth year: 1820
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: William Crook
Gender: Female
Where born: Manchester, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: All Souls
Ecclesiastical parish: All Souls
Town: Manchester
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Registration district: Manchester
Sub-registration district: Ancoats
ED, institution, or vessel: 25

Household schedule number: 50
Piece: 2931
Folio: 96
Page Number: 11

William Crook 40
Hannah Crook 41
William Crook 17
James Crook 16
Sarah Crook 14
Jessie Crook 12
Cornelius Crook 10
Fredrick Crook 8
Richard Crook 3



I don't actually see a death for a Hannah Crook of approximately the correct age between 1861 and 1863

??????????

England & Wales, Criminal Registers, 1791-1892

Name: Cornelius Crooke
Date of Trial: 4 Nov 1878
Trial Year: 1878
Location of Trial: Lancashire, England
Sentence: Imprisonment
Crime: See Image
Date of Execution or Release: See Image

from image:-

Place of Court:- Assizes, Liverpool
Accusation:- Robbery together with another and with violence
Sentence:- 15 Months, and once privately whipped with a Cat of Nine Tails and receive seventy strokes


The men on each side of him were accused of the same crime, and received the same punishment ............. I assume they were probably the c0-accused

John Flaherty and Bryan Clarke

FYI

Manchester, England, Marriages and Banns, 1754-1930 (Cathedral)

Name: William Crook
Birth Year: abt 1823
Marriage Date: 12 Jan 1863
Parish: Manchester, St Mary, St Denys and St George
Father's name: James Crook
Spouse's Name: Hannah Kay
Spouse's Father's Name: James Cutler
Archive Roll: 730

from image:-

Marriage after Banns

William
Age:- 40
Widower
Occupation:- Smith
Address:- 5 Sarah Street
Father occupation:- Weaver

Hannah
Age:- 38
Widow
no occupation shown
Address:- Lyon Street, Ancoats
Father occupation:- Weaver

Witnesses:- Thomas Hilton and Catherine Duffy (their marks)

Hi Sylvia,I get my info off ancestry.co.uk and it doesn't seem to let me copy and paste.

Sorry for causing upset to anyone,I do my best to help.

Maryb.

Mary - if you use a mouse, try changing the batteries. Sometimes ones running out causes that problem.

If that doesnt solve the problem, precede your summary with 'from Ancestry, can't C&P' . That way someone else can find it & copy to the thread.

Keep on trucking - its always a team effort :-D

Cheers Detective,no batteries in mouse so maybe its me who hasn't mastered copy and paste from that site.I will try harder,I promise.

Right I have copied item to my desktop, how do I put it on here?
Said item is about Cornelius Crook convicted for stealing a watch 1866 age 14 and sent to Calder Farm Reformatory School from which he absconded in 1871.
However it states dad James a blacksmith and Step mother Hannah.

Maryb

If it’s in a word doc, in the blue top margin, click Edit, then ‘select all’ which will turn the text black.
Then Edit again, and copy.
Place your curser in the Add your reply box on Genes, then right-click and paste.

If its an image , it won't C&P on to the thread.

You added whilst I was typing - don't think you can newspaper articles to the thread as they are the wrong format.
You could send it to Cane as an attachement

http://mediasvc.ancestry.co.uk/v2/thumbnail/namespaces/8633/media/41418_1831109388_2997-00254.jpg?Client=SearchUI&MaxSide=175&suppressNotFound=true

This is the link to Cornelius Crook in 1866 charged with stealing a watch and stating Hannah is his stepmother!

Maryb.

Crook - Pinnington children

Lancashire Birth indexes for the years: 1844
Surname Forename(s) Sub-District Registers At Mother's Maiden Name Reference
CROOK William Ancoats Archives+, Manchester Central Library PINNINGTON ANC/22/82

Lancashire Birth indexes for the years: 1845
Surname Forename(s) Sub-District Registers At Mother's Maiden Name Reference
CROOK James Ancoats Archives+, Manchester Central Library PINNINGTON ANC/27/81

Lancashire Birth indexes for the years: 1849
Surname Forename(s) Sub-District Registers At Mother's Maiden Name Reference
CROOK Jesse London Road Archives+, Manchester Central Library PINNINGTON LRD/29/9

Lancashire Birth indexes for the years: 1854
Surname Forename(s) Sub-District Registers At Mother's Maiden Name Reference
CROOK Frederick London Road Archives+, Manchester Central Library PINNINGTON LRD/42/46

Lancashire Birth indexes for the years: 1857
Surname Forename(s) Sub-District Registers At Mother's Maiden Name Reference
CROOK John Henry London Road Archives+, Manchester Central Library PINNINGTON LRD/47/72