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1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Oare, Wilcot, Pewsey, Wiltshire, England

Thomas Waite Head Married Male 25 1856 Shoemaker Oare, Wiltshire, England
Katherine Waite Wife Married Female 27 1854 Domestic Duties Hungerford, Berkshire, England
Frederick Rogers Stepson Single Male 8 1873 Scholar Pewsey, Wiltshire, England
May Rogers Step Daughter Single Female 4 1877 Scholar Pewsey, Wiltshire, England
George Waite Son Single Male 0 1881 - Oare, Wiltshire, England

Clutching at straws here

Deaths Mar 1979 (>99%)
ROGERS RUTH 29MR1885 BIRMINGHAM 32 1540


EDIT

Not that one, her maiden name was Harlow

different spelling for Katherine' name .....

Marriages Mar 1879 (>99%)
ROGERS Catharine May Pewsey 5a 202
WAITE Thomas Pewsey 5a 202

???? May's birth registration ......

ROGERS, LYDIA ELIZABETH MAY -
GRO Reference: 1876 J Quarter in PEWSEY Volume 05A Page 180


no mother's madien name, just as there was not for Frederick, so the two were illegitimate.

Katherine/Catharine's marriage to Thomas Waite explains Frederick's use of the surname Waite.


George Waite's birth registration ....

WAITE, GEORGE mmn ROGERS
GRO Reference: 1880 J Quarter in PEWSEY Volume 05A Page 174

WOW. I m stunned ! Thank you everyone. My father was Reginald I didn't really know him as he left my Mother for another in 1964 I was 4 I have had lots of problems as throughout my search I have hit obstacles A I'm a novice B on my father's side they used lots of different surnames . I thought I knew what I was doing as I've traced my maternal side right back to the 1600's . :-D thank you everyone.

Patches, I'm not sure where I got her details from I originally had a different surname for her but then again I'm not surprised because all the way through the Rogers side they used 2 maybe 3 surnames. For years I thought a cousin on my father's side was older than me and called Kath but 2 other people found her and she's younger and called Kristen ! I also found out that my uncle Tom was my father's half brother, I didn't know that! Thanks again Carol :-D

Root gatherer. Thanks you have given me a lot to go on I'll have fun trying to fill my tree in as I said before they went by 2 or 3 different surnames Rogers, Yates and Waite this is why I got in a pickle . Thank you, Carol :-D

Carol, you say that Tom was Reginald's half brother. So are we thinking that Frederick Rogers didn't father all those children's?

Do you think that Ruth and Frederick parted and someone else fathered the younger children?

Like you, I can't find a death for Ruth or possible remarriage. Perhaps she lived with another partner and took his surname.

I'm not too sure about the theory that Frederick had to wait for the death of a first wife before he married Ruth as I can't see a possible marriage for him before hand either as Rogers or Waite.

Not that it helps, but the baptism gives Ruth's DOB:

First name(s) Ruth
Last name Yates
Birth date 26 Jan 1886
Baptism date 27 Mar 1886
Residence Kingsbury Square
Place Marlborough, St Mary the Virgin
County Wiltshire
Father's name(s) Eli Yates
Father's occupation Blacksmith
Mother's name(s) Elizabeth
Record type Parish Registers
---------------------------------------------------

An article about the death of Fred's stepfather in The Salisbury Times - Friday 26 October 1906.

MARLBOROUGH
Fatal fight at the fair. At Marlborough borough petty sessions on Monday before the Mayor (Mr A J Crosby), and other magistrates, William James Hooper, travelling jeweller of Peterborough, was charged, on remand, with the manslaughter of Norman Waite, shoemaker from Oare, Wilts, by knocking him down in Marlborough pleasure fair on October 13th- Frederick James Rogers, labourer, stepson of the deceased stated....
--------------------------------

Other articles give his name as Thomas (not Norman) Waite.

Searching for Ruth with that date of birth (I do not have full access) seems to give only one 'hit' - Ruth Collins in Stratford, and that looks like a legitimate marriage of Ruth Townsend in 1909.

So she died before 1939?

Always possible patchem but her spouse describes himself as married not widowed in 1939. Always possible he misunderstood the question. Can't see any likely death for her or likely remarriage.

rootgatherer, Tom was my fathers half brother, there were 6 full siblings and 2 half siblings, this is what I have found out so far , I do have a tree of sorts
Reg’s oldest 2 brothers, Frederick and Thomas were only ½ brothers.
Their mother Ruth Yates had them before she married husband Frederick J Rogers in 1914 in Devizes, Wiltshire. They used a mixture of the names Rogers and Yates throughout their lives.
Ruth Yates’ husband, Frederick J Rogers was himself was ‘illegitimate’
His mother was Catherine May Rogers who had Frederick and sister Lydia before she married Thomas Waite in 1879. Again, both Lydia and Frederick j used a combination of surnames of Waite and Rogers.
But Frederick dropped the Waite when he married Ruth Yates in 1914.
Reg could have married again in the 1970’s but I am not sure of this. I have met Reg's 2 sons after my Mum's marriage . I can't find a divorce record for them I seem to think / remember it was around 1970 . Thank you so very much
:-D :-D

How can you be sure that Fred and Tom were half brothers of Reg please? To me, and it is only my opinion, if Ruth was their mother and one was named for Fred (Sen) and the other his step father then Fred was almost certainly their father. Also Tom was living with Fred (Sen) in 1939. Even if Fred and Ruth were unmarried at the time of their births it doesn't make them half siblings to Ruth's other children, unless of course Fred wasn't the father of the children born after the marriage.

I had the same thoughts rootgatherer- Fred & Tom are also listed as his sons on the 1911.

Just to add- you're unlikely to find any record of a divorce for around 1970 unless you have the paperwork yourself.

As posted by Rootgatherer on page 1, Ruth's daughters, Kathleen & Mary are living at Mayall Road, Lambeth on the 1939 register:

Mayall Road , Lambeth, London, England

Mary Young (Rogers) 12 Aug 1921 Female Shop Assistant Provision Single
Kathleen C Norbury (Rogers) 02 Feb 1915 Female Confectioners Asst Cak Single
-----------------------------------------------

Ruth is listed at the same address in 1937 / 1938/ 1939 on the electoral registers- so it looks as though she didn't stay with Fred:

1937/ 1938/ 1939
39 Mayall Road, Lambeth
Ruth Rogers
Kathleen Rogers
Agnes Mary Walker
Charles Walker
Edith Violet Walker
James Walker
----------------------------------------------

This is Kathleen and 2 siblings on 1947 electoral register

1947:
119 Mayall Road, Lambeth
Herbert A Norbury
Kathleen C Norbury
William Rogers
Arthur R Young
Mary Young

rootgatherer I actually paid for a lady to search my for my father and thats what the outcome was she even did a gedcom for me but I'm unable to upload it here because it warns me that it'll wipe my existing tree. I'd been stuck for so long and going round in circles that's why I asked her to help (after she offered) . I don't really understand why she would tell me that they were half siblings if they wasn't ! I'm not doubting any of you as to me you all sound very professional and knowledgeable and I'm so so very grateful for any help . What I posted earlier = REG'S oldest 2 brothers etc etc was what she told me in am email . So I'm definitely confused . THANK YOU ALL AGAIN :-(

Hi me again, SylviainCanada wrote on page 1
Re the family in the 1911 Census .......

1911 Census
Fredrick Rogers Head Married Male Farm Labourer 42 1869 Pewsey

Ruth Yates Housekeeper Single Female - 25 1886 Marlborough

Fred Yates Son - Male - 5 1906 Oare

Tom Yates Son - Male - 2 1909 Bishops Cannings


After marriage???

ROGERS, KATHLEEN CORDELIA YATES
GRO Reference: 1915 M Quarter in DEVIZES Volume 05A Page 153

It looks as though Ruth had at least 2 children before marrying Fred Rogers.

YATES, THOMAS -
GRO Reference: 1909 M Quarter in DEVIZES Volume 05A Page 96

Devizes is the registration district that includes Bishops Cannings. There is no mother's maiden name showing, indicating that the child was illegitimate



Two more children born before the marriage??

Couldnt this mean that Ruth Yates had 2 sons before she wed Fred Rogers ? this is according to the 1911 census . MORE CONFUSED

If you google for free software for gedcom there are many that you can download which will at least enable you to open up those gedcom files she has sent to you and see what info she has put on there, without having to put it on here and delete your existing tree.

Or, you may want to purchase software package purely to use on your PC (I have Family Tree Maker ) and then you can put as many different trees as you like on there which will only be visible by you. You can, of course send details (trees or reposts etc) to other people if you wish as gedcoms from there.

Dea x

Thank you Dea , she did print me a copy of the tree and sent it to me so I have been able to see it. :-)
I think I will have a look into some software thanks

Carol, I can understand why you may be confused. I still think Frederick is the father of young Fred and Tom. I'll have another look for a first marriage for Frederick but I really doubt that there is one. Do you have Frederick and Ruth's marriage certificate please? It should state if Frederick was a bachelor, divorced or widowed.