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Georgina...to clarify things a bit........... I worked on this for a while yesterday, on the other thread..............the birth year for Alice on 1881 is mistranscribed. If you check the image, as I did, her age is clearly 34.........so birth year c1847. One of the problems of having more than one thread about the same family......................some of the info is not carried across....... Reg

They like some others in my tree are becoming quite annoying, plenty of information yet far from the complete story ,and therefore still left guessing. Regards Mike

Have got Samuel in 1861 with his parents still a Butcher... Samuel Dawson abt 1839 Rochdale, Lancashire, England Son Butterworth Lancashire Sarah Dawson abt 1813 Keighley, Yorkshire, England Wife Butterworth Lancashire Thomas Dawson abt 1814 Walsden, Lancashire, England Head Butterworth Lancashire William Dawson abt 1844 Rochdale, Lancashire, England Son Butterworth Lancashire Source information: RG9/3032 Registration district: Rochdale Sub-registration district: Butterworth Freehold Side ED, institution, or vessel: 1 Folio: 18 Page: 30 (click to see others on page) Household schedule number: 157 GSU Number: 543067 Georgina.

There is another in 1864 - on LancsBMD.

Georgina That i believe to tobe the correct marriage and i have sent for that certificate Regards Mike

They did have trade directories then, but I'm not sure if they're accessible... back in a mo :)

Possible marriage for Samuel (not good at geography) but they did move around quite a bit. Marriages Dec 1862 Buckley Alice Oldham 8d 797 Dawson Samuel Oldham 8d 797 Hamill Hannah Oldham 8d 797 Schofield Junia Oldham 8d 797 Georgina.

Mike if you think Alice is Samuels first wife maybe Sarah & Elizabeth were Sarah's from a previous marriage and Samuel gave them his name? Maybe Elizabeth is Sarah and decided to Change her name? Georgina.

Tracy did they have Trade directories in the 1860's and 1870's,if so would i not possibly be able to locate the whereabouts of Samuel in them at the time of Elizabeths birth and the 1871 census Regards Mike

Tracy I have looked at every Samuel born within 5 years of 1839 on the 1871 census and none are Butchers so I agree with you they must have been missed or mistranscribed. Georgina.

I'm inclined to think that they've been missed off 1871. I can't find any of them at all. I've looked under all names, dobs, and pobs. Such a shame Clara wasn't born the year before! lol

Tracy Samuels name is from the 1884 marriage certificate and that is also the correct Elizabeth you have on the 1881 in Manchester. Helen if you view the image on the 1881 you will she that alice's age has been mistranscribed Regards Mike

Georgina / Tracy thats brilliant ,without the 1871 ive so far been unable to see Elizabeth with her family,being a twin makes sense now. Regards Mike

Georgina, you might be right... DAWSON Sarah A Castleton Further Rochdale CF/15/56 DAWSON Elizabeth Castleton Further Rochdale CF/15/197 I'll go check BMD. Ok, I won't cos it's not transcribed lol Is this her? Elizabeth Dawson abt 1864 Chester, Cheshire, England Servant 107 Reather St, Manchester, Lancashire, England The only one I can find in 1871, is the Tattenhall one. Where did you get Samuels name? A marriage cert?

Mike this is the 1881 census (for reference) this is obviously Samuels 2nd marriage because his wife is only 24. If Elizabeth was born in 1865 was she Sarah's Twin because Sarah was born about 1865? Alice Dawson abt 1857 Butterworth, Lancashire, England Wife 97 Cavendish St, Barrow In Furness, Lancashire, England Alice Dawson abt 1877 Barrow, Lancashire, England Daughter 97 Cavendish St, Barrow In Furness, Lancashire, England Clara Dawson abt 1872 Manchester, Lancashire, England Daughter 97 Cavendish St, Barrow In Furness, Lancashire, England Florence Dawson abt 1875 Barrow, Lancashire, England Daughter 97 Cavendish St, Barrow In Furness, Lancashire, England Frank Dawson abt 1881 Barrow, Lancashire, England Son 97 Cavendish St, Barrow In Furness, Lancashire, England Samuel Dawson abt 1839 Whitworth, Lancashire, England Head 97 Cavendish St, Barrow In Furness, Lancashire, England Samuel Dawson abt 1879 Barrow, Lancashire, England Son 97 Cavendish St, Barrow In Furness, Lancashire, England Sarah A. Dawson abt 1865 Castleton, Lancashire, England Daughter 97 Cavendish St, Barrow In Furness, Lancashire, England Source information: RG11/4287 Registration district: Barrow In Furness Sub-registration district: Barrow In Furness ED, institution, or vessel: 8c Folio: 90 Page: 67 Georgina.

Hi Tracy Its a mistranscription she was born abt 1847 not 1857. They were married 1862 in the Oldham district Regards Mike

Hi Tracy The one that i'm looking for has a father called Samuel i hope and hes a Butcher Regards Mike

Do you know when and where Samuel married Alice? Seems a bit young to be Sarah and Elizabeths mother lol oh, n/m - it's wrong in 1881.

I found the Tattenhall one - her father is William. Can't see the other though (might be her!)

Tracy thank you very much for that,unfortunately to date have been unable to locate the family on the 1871 census. Will now have to send off for the certificates and hope one of them is correct Thank you once again Regards Mike