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Just to let you know that there is a duplicate thread on the Trying to Find Board that has a bit more info
Selena

What was the naval orphanage - Ive never heard of one? Why would the kids go there?

Margaret, here is the 1881 - Little George Street is in Bermondsey, not near St James Park (used to work there).


James LACEY Head M Male 30 St Martins, Middlesex, England Police Constable
Isabella LACEY Wife M Female 28 St Martins, Middlesex, England
Isabella LACEY Daur Female 1 St Olaves, Surrey, England


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Source Information:
Dwelling 48 Little George St
Census Place Bermondsey, Surrey, England
Family History Library Film 1341128
Public Records Office Reference RG11
Piece / Folio 0563 / 87
Page Number 44

Selena

The problem is that the business was somewhere in London - General Dealers could be anything and Edward was abroad working for the family business. I know its very confusing, its confusing for me. Why would my dad never speak of his dad! Why did Edward send his eldest son, when a teenager, also called Edward to work as a bell boy on a ship between England and Belgium! Edward the son was repatriated back to London when his father died - this I know from my cousins - Edward junior's children. As I said, my dad's two brothers were in a naval orphanage for a time in London?how long. ?did he leave my gran, she would never speak of him also. There are so many unanswered questions. It may be that a trip to Antwerp is what I may need to do. I have been led to believe that somerset house would have a record of his death even though he died abroad, but for me this would mean a trip to London and I live in Shropshire, that is why I put the message on the board to see if anyone could help me with this who lives near or in the future is planning a trip to somerset house.

It was a bit adventurous to start a business abroad then wasnt it? You should be able to find something out about that for sure!

My gt grandfather James lived Little George St in 1881, but my grandfather Edward was born 62 The Grange, Bermondsey in 1882 and we the family believe James died in 1884. Edward worked at several police stations in London between 1907 and 1913 - Wandsworth, Albany St (Where my dad was born), Brixton, Marylebone) and left to work for the family business - just named as General Dealers, in Belgium. James or his father John had a brother called William and it was William who started Lacey's Coaches who are still in service today.

Then not likely to have died in Southwark?? If he was living north of the river then Id spend the £7 on that Islington death cert. - Id assumed you knew he was in Southwark when he died because of the exact date/area info you gave??. But if he was in fact north of the river, Islington would fit ok. Just check no others of same age living that area on census.

What was the family business you mention? Only mention of police officers here?

Thanks very much Heather. Just to let you know my gt grandfather James according to the 1881 census lived in Little George St which on the map I found to be close to St. James's Park and the Houses of Parliament.

Police book of rembrance

http://www.met.police.uk/history/remembrance2.htm

In that case, it may be worth buying that cert from Islington area? In case he did indeed die there on duty. Seems to be right age - have a check on census to see if another guy same age is about first. And google for police deaths.

Southwark, Bermondsey and Rotherhithe most definitely south of the river and hence Surrey! I was born there.

Sorry Heather, just looked at the cert and it does say Surrey.

My gt grandfather James, we are led to believe was in the river police and it had been banded around the family that he died whilst trying to save a life from the Thames.

On the certificates I have it says Middlesex!! This is it, I don't rightly know. I know he resigned from the police force in 1913 and it is my familys belief he went to Antwerp to work in the family business abroad. He is a real mystery man, who we believe died of an epileptic fit in Paris and is buried in an Antwerp cemetary. I do know that when he went to Belgium he left my gran with her three young sons, my dad being the youngest was brought up for many years by her parents in Worcestershire and the two elder boys were put into a naval orphanage in London. They were all eventually reunited as a family and she was a lovely lady but she and my dad never spoke about my grandfather.

With the death - did he die on duty? If so he may not have been in Southwark at the time?

Deaths Jun 1884

Lacey James 34 Islington 1b 194

Have you discounted this one? Just for luck, you have one of mine in that lot, Caroline Dixon - this is Southwark area:

Births Jun 1851 (>99%)
Brock Emma S Saviour 4 565 Scan available - click to view
COLE Alfred S Saviour 4 565 Scan available - click to view
Dixon Caroline St Saviour 4 565 Scan available - click to view
Grange Leon Camille St Saviour 4 565 Scan available - click to view
Henman William St Saviour 4 565 Scan available - click to view
>>>>Lacey James George St Saviour 4 565 Scan available - click to view
Martin George St Saviour Southwark 4 565 Scan available - click to view
Povah Mary Ann Wilson St Saviour 4 565 Scan available - click to view
Sansum William S.Saviours 4 565 Scan available - click to view
SIMPSON Eliza St Saviour's 4 565 Scan available - click to view
Taylor John Lambeth 4 565

Just a point, Southwark was in Surrey, not Middlesex. What was he doing in Paris? Did he died from war injuries?

Thanks Reg and Sam. Tried all these with no luck.

The overseas death should be on findmypast......a pay-to-view site.

Reg

Birth registration wasn't compulsory until 1875.....you may not find anything for the 1851 birth

Reg

Have you looked on FreeBMD for the first one?

Sam x