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Hi Keith

Have just found out that in 1871 - the Agars
( Agar /Orton ) also lived in Shenton Street- No 27!

I would like to think that Elizabeth nee Orton (No 19)
and Mary nee Orton (No27) were sisters
(or cousins) - but as yet still cant find the actual connection - need to find details of Marys birth, to see who her parents were?????

Regards
Gill

Hi Keith

Emma Kilbys parents were:
John Kilby & Elizabeth Orton and in 1881 they lived at 19 Shenton St, Leicester

And in 1876 you found this marriage:
Agar Edward Henry Leicester 7a 584
Orton Mary Jane Leicester 7a 584

What I dont yet know is, who Mary Jane Orton is in relation to Elizabeth Orton ????

Any thoughts??
Gill

Thanks Keith

Have been away, so only just picked up your replies on my thread.

Thank you so much for all your hard work.

I originally started out looking to fnd the relatationship of Emma Kilby to the Agars.

I think we have 'come close' to finding it as :
1971 you found a Mary Orton and I know that the Ortons married into the Kilbys.

And in 1876 you found this marriage:
Agar Edward Henry Leicester 7a 584
Orton Mary Jane Leicester 7a 584
So there is definately a connection - but not sure exactly what it is yet.

The census 1881 that you found - this family are in my tree, so we are on the right track..
Arthur C. Kilby
Elizabeth A. Kilby 23
Hetty K. Kilby 1
John I. Kilby 23 Professor of Music, born Leicestershire


Not sure where to go next as I still havent fround the eaxct connection between Emma Kilby & the Agars

Thank you so much for your help ...really do appreciate it.
Kind regards
Gill

Gillian????? Is this of any use to you?

Three of the childrens births and christenings on this batch on IGI, Batch Number: C034371.

From the IGI extracted record.

THOMAS AGAR
Marriages:
Spouse: SARAH LUMLEY Family
Marriage: 22 DEC 1830 Belgrave, Leicester, England

After all this, we are still no nearer to finding out how Emma is the neice of Edward.

Got to leave this now, its time for bed here.

Looks like Eliza married William Minor, but age does not tie in with 1861/71 census possible she "lost" a few years for the sake of the marriage.
Marriages Mar 1874 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Agar Eliza Leicester 7a 320
Minor William Leicester 7a 320


Name: Eliza Minor
Age: 33
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1848
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: William
Gender: Female
Where born: Belgrave, Leicestershire, England

Civil Parish: Leicester St Margaret
County/Island: Leicestershire
Country: England

Street address: 118 Dorset St
Condition as to marriage: Married
Education:

Employment status: View Image
Occupation: Housewife

Registration district: Leicester
Sub-registration district: East Leicester
ED, institution, or vessel: 80
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Eliza Minor 33
Harry Minor
William Minor 32
William Minor 6

Source Citation: Class: RG11; Piece: 3167; Folio: 105; Page: 16

Emma married Richard Barratt
Marriages Mar 1858 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

AGAR Emma Sarah Leicester 7a 193
BARRATT Richard Leicester 7a 193

1861 census.
Name: Emma Barratt
Age: 22
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1839
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Richard
Gender: Female
Where born: Belgrave, Leicestershire, England

Civil Parish: Leicester St Margaret
Ecclesiastical parish: St Margaret
Town: Leicester
County/Island: Leicestershire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View Image

Registration district: Leicester
Sub-registration district: East Leicester
ED, institution, or vessel: 22
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 70
Household Members: Name Age
Emma Barratt 22
Richard Barratt 29

Source Citation: Class: RG9; Piece: 2286; Folio: 10; Page: 13

Looks possible Ann Agar b 1832 on 1851 married Henry Pretty

Marriages Dec 1856 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Agar Ann Leicester 7a 438
Pretty Henry Leicester 7a 438

1861 census.
Name: Ann Pretty
Age: 30
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1831
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Henry
Gender: Female
Where born: Belgrave, Leicestershire, England

Civil Parish: Leicester St Margaret
Ecclesiastical parish: St Margaret
Town: Leicester
County/Island: Leicestershire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View Image

Registration district: Leicester
Sub-registration district: East Leicester
ED, institution, or vessel: 22
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 117
Household Members: Name Age
Ann Pretty 30
Henry Pretty 30
Sarah A Pretty 4 Mo
Tom H Pretty 2

Source Citation: Class: RG9; Piece: 2286; Folio: 13; Page: 20

I cannot find any Agar/Kilby marriages on FreeBMD.

Unfortunately I cannot find the same family in 1891, but this looks like them in 1881. I am trying to ascertain who she married and when, but cannot find a marriage at the moment.

Name: Elizabeth A. Kilby
Age: 23
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1858
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: John I.
Gender: Female
Where born: Seagrave, Leicestershire, England

Civil Parish: Leicester St Margaret
County/Island: Leicestershire
Country: England

Street address: 19 Shenton St
Condition as to marriage: Married
Education:

Employment status: View Image

Registration district: Leicester
Sub-registration district: East Leicester
ED, institution, or vessel: 40
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Arthur C. Kilby
Elizabeth A. Kilby 23
Hetty K. Kilby 1
John I. Kilby 23 Professor of Music, born Leicestershire

Source Citation: Class: RG11; Piece: 3162; Folio: 4; Page: 8


EDIT disregard this, it cannot be Elizabeth Agar, the ages dont match!!! Doh!!

Could this be Emma in 1901?

Name: Emma G Kilby
Age: 16
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1885
Relation: Daughter
Mother's Name: Elizabeth A
Gender: Female
Where born: Lester, Leicester

Civil Parish: Leicester Formerly St Margaret
Ecclesiastical parish: Leicester St Saviour
County/Island: Leicestershire
Country: England

Street address: Beal or Real Street.

Occupation: Shoe machinist.

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View Image

Registration district: Leicester
Sub-registration district: North East Leicester
ED, institution, or vessel: 15
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 248
Household Members: Name Age
Elizabeth A Kilby 38 Widow b Seagrove?
Emma G Kilby 16
Herbert F Kilby 14
Hettie R Kilby 21
Vincent W Kilby 18
Emma Sherwin 37
Ethel L Steele 1
George E Steele 36
Harold Steele 8

Source Citation: Class: RG13; Piece: 2996; Folio: 147; Page: 43

Possible Mary J Orton in 1871?

Name: Mary J Orton
Age: 14
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1857
Relation: Niece
Gender: Female
Where born: South Kilworth, Leicestershire, England

Civil Parish: North Kilworth
Ecclesiastical parish: St Andrew
Town: North Kilworth
County/Island: Leicestershire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View Image

Registration district: Lutterworth
Sub-registration district: Lutterworth
ED, institution, or vessel: 17
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 78
Household Members: Name Age
Clara Asher 14
Eliza Ball 45
George Ball 47
Lucy A Kendal 9
Mary J Orton 14

Head of the family is George.

Source Citation: Class: RG10; Piece: 3222; Folio: 23; Page: 14

the marriage of Edward and Mary J, was hoping she was a Kilby.

Marriages Dec 1876 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Agar Edward Henry Leicester 7a 584
GOODMAN Jane Leicester 7a 584
Orton Mary Jane Leicester 7a 584
Richardson Joseph Leicester 7a 584

Looks to me as if the ages of Sarah and Elizabeth have been recorded incorrectly in 1871 and the status to head.

1841

Name: Thomas Agar
Age: 33
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1808
Gender: Male
Where born: Leicestershire, England

Civil Parish: St Margaret With Bishops Fee
Hundred: Leicester Borough
County/Island: Leicestershire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation: View Image

Registration district: Leicester
Sub-registration district: East Leicester
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Ann Agar 9
Emma Agar 2
Sarah Agar 32
Thomas Agar 33
Thomas Agar 6

Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece 604; Book: 7; Civil Parish: St Margaret With Bishops Fee; County: Leicestershire; Enumeration District: 13; Folio: 10; Page: 12; Line: 9

So looke like Thomas and Sarah married before registration, have to look on the IGI for possible marriages there.

Looks like we have all the probable children, so now to look for marriages for them.

Hmmm....

1861 Thomas & Sarah - (William, Elizabeth, Edward)
1871 Thomas & Elizabeth, (Edward, Sarah)

Is it definately the same family - or was Thomas married twice?

Got to go out now ..but will catch up soon. Thanks for your help Keith - I have moved forward a bit more.
ind regards
Gill

1851.

Name: Edward R Agar
Age: 6
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1845
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Thomas
Mother's Name: Sarah
Gender: Male
Where born: St Margaret, Leicestershire, England

Civil Parish: Leicester St Margaret
Town: Leicester
County/Island: Leicestershire
Country: England

Street address: Nelson Street.

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View Image

Registration district: Leicester
Sub-registration district: East Leicester
ED, institution, or vessel: 20
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 63
Household Members: Name Age
Ann Agar 19
Edward R Agar 6
Eliza Agar 9
Emma S Agar 11
Sarah Agar 41
Thomas Agar 43
Thomas Agar 16
William Agar 3

Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece: 2088; Folio: 393; Page: 16

1861 Edward is a coach trimmer, but the wife is shown as Sarah.

Name: Edward Agar
Age: 16
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1845
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Thomas
Mother's Name: Sarah
Gender: Male
Where born: Belgrave, Leicestershire, England

Civil Parish: Leicester St Margaret
Ecclesiastical parish: St Margaret
Town: Leicester
County/Island: Leicestershire
Country: England

Street address: Nelson Place

Occupation: Coach trimmer

Condition as to marriage: View Image

Registration district: Leicester
Sub-registration district: East Leicester
ED, institution, or vessel: 22
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 105
Household Members: Name Age
Edward Agar 16
Eliza Agar 19
Sarah Agar 51
Thomas Agar 53
William Agar 13

Source Citation: Class: RG9; Piece: 2286; Folio: 12; Page: 18