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Hi Saul, Was hoping it would be soon lol

June x

Hello there

Just to let interested parties know that i have not had the opportunity yet to discuss all the findings with my work colleague as he is out of the country

Will post something of his reaction here once we meet

Well done on finding the Worts in the 1861 census!

Pin Grinder - it sounds an awful job , as did the jobs of William wort - screw cutter and tube filler!!

1881 maybe cant find this one in any other census

Name: Ann Lyddidtt
Age: 23
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1858
Relation: Lodger
Gender: Female
Where born: Bham, Warwickshire, England

Civil Parish: Harborne
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England

Street address: 3 Tube Works Row
Education:

Employment status: View Image
Occupation: Pin Grinder

Registration district: Kings Norton
Sub-registration district: Harborne
ED, institution, or vessel: 16
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Ann Lyddidtt 23
Ann Williams 16
Robt. Williams 54
Rosina Williams 1
Susanna Williams 50
Susanna Williams 11
Wm. Williams 20



June x

1871

Name: George Wart
Age: 13
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1858
Relation: Son
Father's Name: William
Mother's Name: Lucy
Gender: Male
Where born: Birmingham, Warwickshire, England

Civil Parish: Birmingham
Ecclesiastical parish: St Barnabas
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View Image

Registration district: Birmingham
Sub-registration district: Lady Wood
ED, institution, or vessel: 12
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 11
Household Members: Name Age
Alfred Wart 9
George Wart 13
John T Wart 2
Lucy Wart 40
Thomas Wart 7
William Wart 40
William H Wart 18




1861

Name: George West
Age: 3
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1858
Relation: Son
Father's Name: William
Mother's Name: Lucy
Gender: Male
Where born: Birmingham, Warwickshire, England

Civil Parish: Birmingham
Ecclesiastical parish: St Thomas
Town: Birmingham
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View Image

Registration district: Birmingham
Sub-registration district: St Thomas
ED, institution, or vessel: 20
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 212
Household Members: Name Age
Mary Powell 40 lodger
William Powell 12
Emily West 4
George West 3
Lucy West 31
William West 30
William H West 9


image reads Wort



1851
Name: William Wort
Age: 22
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1829
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Lucy
Gender: Male
Where born: Birmm, Warwickshire, England

Civil Parish: Birmingham St Thomas
Town: Birmingham
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View Image

Registration district: Birmingham
Sub-registration district: St Thomas
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 130
Household Members: Name Age
Lucy Wort 21
William Wort 22



June x

Hi June

Don't worry about the last query have managed to trace William back to 1841 census - appears Williams grandfather George aged 77 was still alive then!

Could not find the marriage of William and Lucy who are married in the 1851 census , nor find them in the 1861 census

This investigation still has more legs than Twiggy!

Is there any sign of William and Lucy Wort before the 1881 Census where George is a 23 year old married man staying with them?

Just incase you get bored tomorrow June !!!

Another point looking back still unsolved is ...

where is Anne Elizabeth Lydeard/Wort in 1881?

I then go back to the marriage or non marriage of George Wort and Annie/Elizabeth Lydeard

On TG's birth cert in 1881 his mother is written as Elizabeth Wort (nee Lydeard) giving the assumption they were married.

Yet is seems they did not marry until 1910!!

would love to see that cert to check out their ages but if it is "our couple" they would have been marrying at the age of 50ish! - why?!?

Hi June

Great stuff - you are keeping ahead of me!

Firstly yes you are right about the 1901 census being Elizabeth Wort the mother of TG (I got William mixed up -but that is the younger brother , Elizabeth also fits of course)

The fact that she has an Adolphus then links her as nee Lydeard.

Of course it is interesting why her father sometimes uses Adolphus and sometimes not

Is it a German name ?

Surely no anti Germanic feeling at this time was there- I though Albert (husband of Victoria was very popular ) though also remeber there was much anti royal feeling in the midlle of her reign?!

Going off track I fear - but that's the fun of it!

Name: Ann Elizabeth Lydeard
Year of Registration: 1858
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
District: Birmingham (1837-1924)
County: Warwickshire
Volume: 6d
Page: 62 (click to see others on page



1861

Name: Ann E Lydiard
Age: 2
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1859
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Adolphus H
Mother's Name: Sarah
Gender: Female
Where born: Birmingham, Warwickshire, England

Civil Parish: Birmingham
Ecclesiastical parish: St Thomas
Town: Birmingham
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View Image

Registration district: Birmingham
Sub-registration district: St Thomas
ED, institution, or vessel: 24
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 107
Household Members: Name Age
Adolphus H Lydiard 25
Agnes Lydiard 7 Mo
Ann E Lydiard 2
Nelson H Lydiard 5
Sarah Lydiard 32




1871

Name: Ann Lydeard
Age: 12
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1859
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Henry
Mother's Name: Sarah
Gender: Female
Where born: Birmingham, Warwickshire, England

Civil Parish: Birmingham
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mark
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View Image

Registration district: Birmingham
Sub-registration district: Lady Wood
ED, institution, or vessel: 23
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 172
Household Members: Name Age
Agnes Lydeard 18 / 10 on image
Ann Lydeard 12
Henry Lydeard 34
Julia Lydeard 2
Louisa Lydeard 6
Mary Ann Lydeard 8
Nelson H Lydeard 15
Sarah Lydeard 40


Marriages Sep 1855 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bevan Sarah Birmingham 6d 154
LYDEARD Henry Birmingham 6d 154





June x

This is weird indeed!

I am going to run of all the census information read, digest and then present it to my friend at some point . Maybe this will lead him to more information - certainly the purchase of that marriage certificate would seem interesting

Marriages Mar 1910 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


LYDEARD Annie Elizabeth Birmingham 6d 123
Wort George Birmingham 6d 123



look at this marriage
what do you think , has on all census she is Annie E


June x

Hi Saul look at top of page for the 1901 census mother is still alive with children

June x

Hello June

Well excellent sleuthing by you I think!!

Firstly your post of 10.46 today

The 1901 census entry is almost certainly the Wort we are looking for as my colleague told me he knows his grandfather was in the Army - so well done on that

The 1891 census entry also fits very well and seems very promising

The 1881 census showing his father as a young man does look good but then where is the mother?

Also then I am wondering where/when the marriage took place?

On TG Worts birth certificate his mother is recorded as Elizabeth Wort formerly Lydeard. I have found the birth of an Elizabeth Lydeard in 1858 (which is a nice match for George Wort also born in 1858) but have not found a marriage - your next mission!!!

I think perhaps that when George says he is a widower in 1901 that may be true - because TG Wort is almost certainly by then a soldier

In that case we are looking also for the death of an Elizabeth Wort sometime between 1891 and 1901

thanks for all your help so far - I will have plenty to tell my colleague when i go back to work!!

Firstly a mail to thank Avril for the information on 1881 census regarding Nelson street

Avril - the Thomas George Wort I was looking for is the grandfather of a friend so fortunatley he is not the one you found who died aged 1

1901

Name: William Wort
Age: 17
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1884
Relation: Son
Mother's Name: Anne E
Gender: Male
Where born: Birmingham

Civil Parish: Birmingham
Ecclesiastical parish: Summerfield Christchurch
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:married

Education:

Employment status: View Image

Registration district: Birmingham
Sub-registration district: Lady Wood
ED, institution, or vessel: 23
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 259
Household Members: Name Age
Adolphus H Wort 6
Anne E Wort 42
Elizabeth Wort 12
William Wort 17




Births Mar 1889 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Wort Elizabeth Birmingham 6d 58



so where is Elizabeth in 1891 census
and why does husband George say he is widower in 1901 ?
found Elizabeth in 1891 census she is on image with her
parents

June x

1901

Name: George Wort
Age: 43
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1858
Relation: Brother
Gender: Male
Where born: Birmingham, Warwickshire, England

Civil Parish: Birmingham
Ecclesiastical parish: St Margaret
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:tube filer

Condition as to marriage:widower

Education:

Employment status: View Image

Registration district: Birmingham
Sub-registration district: Lady Wood
ED, institution, or vessel: 42
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 64
Household Members: Name Age
Ada Wort 3
Ada J Wort 26
George Wort 43
John J Wort 32
Winifred A Wort 1



June x

1901

Name: T G Wort
Age: 19
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1882
Gender: Male
Where born: Birmingham, Warwickshire, England

Civil Parish: Aldershot Military in Stanhope and Wellington Lines
Ecclesiastical parish: Aldershot St Michael
County/Island: Hampshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View Image

Registration district: Farnham
Sub-registration district: Aldershot
ED, institution, or vessel: First Home Counties Reserve Regiment and Fifth Royal Irish Regiment
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 1





1891
Name: Homas G Wort
Age: 9
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1882
Relation: Son
Father's Name: George
Mother's Name: Ann E
Gender: Male
Where born: Birmingham, Warwickshire, England

Civil Parish: Birmingham
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mark
Town: Birmingham
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View Image

Registration district: Birmingham
Sub-registration district: Lady Wood
ED, institution, or vessel: 25
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Ann E Wort 32
Elsie L Wort 2/12
George Wort 33 Birmingham, Warwickshire
Homas G Wort 9
William Wort 7
William Wort 7




Deaths Mar 1892 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Wort Elsie Lavinia age 1 Birmingham 6d 19




1881

Name: George Wort
Age: 23
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1858
Relation: Son
Father's Name: William
Mother's Name: Lucy
Gender: Male
Where born: Birm'm, Warwickshire, England

Civil Parish: Birmingham
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England

Street address: 54 Grosnr St House 2 CT 6
Condition as to marriage: Married
Education:

Employment status: View Image
Occupation: Tube Filer

Registration district: Birmingham
Sub-registration district: Lady Wood
ED, institution, or vessel: 12
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Albert Wort 8
Alfred Wort 19
George Wort 23
Henry Wort 5
John Wort 13
Lucy Wort 50
William Wort 49


June x

George Thomas Wort
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1882
Year of Registration: 1883
Quarter of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
Age at Death: 1
District: Alderbury
County: Wiltshire
Volume: 5a
Page: 95 (click to see others on page)
i am wondering if this is your thomas as well