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Please anyone help me find the family of Alice Holtom (nee Hicks) born 1907 chipping norton district

Alice married my grandfather in 1931 in the district of Chipping Norton, but she died 6 weeks later at the age of 24 and is buried in churchill churchyard near chipping norton, but the strange thing is that no husband is mentioned on the stone , it only says daugther of Raymond & Amy Hicks. We think they did not want them to marry (due to talk we have heard in the family)

We have only just found out that they had a child called leonard who was born before they wed in 1929 but he died aged 3 yrs 9mths in aug 1933 and is also buried in churchill but not with his mum infact across the other side of the churchyard, and his stone does not mention parents at all.

I have found the marriage of Raymond & amy hicks 3a 1999 in the 4th Qtr 1905 but cannot find their deaths or anyone contacted to them.

I would like to know who leonard lived with up to his death because I knew it was not GF's family and also the headstones where made by the same stonemason as everything about them are the same so i think it was alice's parents who had him.

Hope this makes sense if not please ask away

Thanks
John

Name: Raymond Thomas Hicks
Year of Registration: 1902
Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
District: Chipping Norton
County: Gloucestershire, Oxfordshire, Warwickshire
Volume: 3a
Page: 1011 (click to see others on page)


This could be his birth .......

BUT have you got the marriage certificate ? coz that would REALLY help ......

Kempinthesuitcasewithtinhat,

John says they married 1905.

Rose

Thanks Rose .....!!...just found that Raymonds death!!!!

Raymond in 1901

1901 England Census
Name: Raymond Hicks
Age: 20
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1881
Relation: Boarder
Gender: Male
Where born: Great Rissington, Gloucestershire, England
Civil Parish: Sarsden
Ecclesiastical parish: Churchill All Saints and Sarsden St James
Town: Sarsden
County/Island: Oxfordshire
Country: England
Registration district: Chipping Norton
Sub-registration district: Charlbury
ED, institution, or vessel: 13
Household schedule number: 22
Household Members: Name Age
Raymond Hicks 20
Ann Mullington 69
John Mullington 68

Rose

1881 England Census
about Raymond Hicks
Name: Raymond Hicks
Age: 1
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1880
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Thomas
Mother's Name: Martha
Gender: Male
Where born: Gt Rissington, Gloucestershire, England
Civil Parish: Great Rissington
County/Island: Gloucestershire
Country: England
Registration district: Stow On The Wold
Sub-registration district: Bourton On The Water
ED, institution, or vessel: 6
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Alice Hicks 11
Amely Hicks 6
Benjamin Hicks 4
Gabriel Hicks 10
John Hicks 13
Martha Hicks 36
Raymond Hicks 1
Thomas Hicks 40

Rose

Name: Raymond Hicks
Year of Registration: 1880
Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
District: Stow On The Wold
County: Gloucestershire, Worcestershire
Volume: 6a
Page: 404 (click to see others on page)


There is this one but the place is a little out .....

Sorry I deleted by mistake ...but prehaps this fits with Stow on the wold as Reg dist

Thanks for all that info, I have now added it to my tree, can anyone see when Raymond Hicks died or his wife Amy please.

John

Right ...I,ve spent a couple of hours looking for these death but cant find anything ...but it doesnt mean they aint there coz they could have moved or been registered under a different name ..

do you have the marriage cert ..it may give you more clues

No I don't have the cert but I know they married in the dist chipping norton and the number is 3a 1999, it was a long shot and to be honest I don't know how I will find out who he lived with after his mum die , sorry on about leonard now ! I have filled in raymond & amy on my tree but all the people who have them in their trees know nothing well raymonds anyway I cannot find any one with amy wilks in theirs (maiden name). but thanks so much for looking, just not sure where to look now

Thanks john

Would the local newspaper have had an obituary for either Alice or Leonard?

It might be worth trying to find that



sylvia

OR can you get Leonard's death certificate and see who was the informant, and their relationship to him?

Have you got Alice's death certificate to see what she died of, under what name she was registered, what it says about her marital status, and who was the informant?


sylvia

death registrations

Alice E.M. Holtom, age 24, registered Chipping North, December quarter 1931, vol 3a page 1299

Leonard W.J. Holtom, age 3, registered Chipping North, September quarter 1933, vol 3a p. 1102.



I think you need to order some of these certificates, and the Hicks parents marriage one, as that will answer some of your questions

Each certificate will cost £7 through www.gro.gov.uk



sylvia

Sylvia, I know alice die of TB, but I will get the certs for her and leonard to see what he died of, will the cert tell me who the informant was ?
John

John

It does indeed!


A death certificate tells you the persons name, where they lived or died, what they died of, their age, and the informant's name and address, and relationship if applicable.

It should also say "wife of .....", widow of ...." son of ......" etc.

Some of the information may be at odds with what you know, as age or full name for example depend on what the informant knws or has been told by the dead person!


sylvia

Must just say .....a little while ago some one on here told of a certificate (death) that gave NO information on the informants .....she was very up-set coz she thought it would solve her problem .....


Is there NO ONE left in that family to ask?

No one knew about this child! my hubby told his dad what we had found and he was shocked because he sat with his dad as he was dying and he never said a word, only my sister in law knew that he had been married before because she said she was doing a tree and he took her to the churchyard and said that he had 2 wifes buried there, but he never told his own children and my F in l said in those days you never asked. a lady asked my f in l when he was about 16 if he was from the 1st or 2nd marriage so he said the 2nd even though he did not know what she was on about and he has keep that to himself for 55 yrs, but thinking now he thinks the lady might have thought he was leonard!! of course that lady is long gone now and no-one knows nothing, I have even tried the hicks side but nothing there either, in fact no-one has anything on alice or her parents except just mentioned in their tree, so you can see how stuck I am..

OMG ......I know what you mean about the HIcks family ..........If you want to keep a secret be a HICKS .........

John ...I,m one thats why I,m so intrested .....But you need to get the certificates you can it may hold the key!!!

do let me know ......would love to know what was going on !!

I'm back. been to germany on business..

I have sent away for the cert so lets hope I find something out, I think it is because it is a child that has got me and the same age as my grandson. it is really strange how there is nothing about them, i think the grand parents must have moved away because I cannot find their deaths anywhere at all but they all lived around this area i.e in the then district of chipping norton. My wife is off to put flowers on the grave and tidy it up this weekend so must find out something about him.
John