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its ok, as i copied it anyway just in case someone was kind enough to give me a certain breakdown.all i wanted was to know who was the parents, as i was finding different ones with same childrens names ect..and somewhat got a tad confusing................... i do appreciate all yr help you have all given me.............suppose i confused myself on some issues.................

So all the info I gave you yesterday seems to correct about Electra being her mum.

All of which I have now deleted as you didn't think it was relevant and you started this thread.

Maryb.

haha see still confusing .................thanks for that anyway your a star, wil work with what i have for now and see if i can puzzle it all together now xxxxxxxxxxxxx

sorry - my mistake I will edit the above post

would it not be thomas and Jane, ( not mary )

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/records.page/transcription/e1911household/27764899 inze inmate list, in workhouse...............

and thank you so much for clarifying it , i will stick to this way and omit the other names.was getting to a confusing state.............

above all would make sense now and totally understand were your comming from.

I really appreciate yr patience with me on this one.................just suppose i needed someone to confirm it 100% and simplify it for me .

thnak you very much. xxxxx

sorry Tracey but I do not think that census link for John & Mary has anything to do with your family. There are only 2 children named a Frank & a Mary - neither of which appear in any other census with Electra etc.

To summarise what we have found

Electra / Electra / Elector Hirst born 1870 to parents Thomas & Jane as shown by patchem - freebmd has only 1 birth which fits so must be correct family

Inze Hirst born 1889 to Electa who is unmarried as shown by birth certificate (there is only 1 Inze in the birth index so the certificate you have must be the right one) When magnified the name on the certificate is definitely Electa in both mother's name & informant columns

Electa Hirst marries William Hammond Parker, a hairdresser, in 1894 as shown by freebmd & census returns

Inze Hirst marries Frank Gibson in 1911 naming father as William Hirst a hairdresser
many children do not wish to be shown as being illegitimate on their marriage certificate and 'invent' a father. In this case Inze seems to have borrowed her stepfather's forename and occupation even tho she may never have lived with them or only until she was old enough to work. She might not be listed in the orphanage as an orphan but as a live in servant. Do I remember seeing she was described as a servant in both 1901 & 1911? I can't see either census for myself as I have no access.

all that makes sense to me but..................

why am i getting the same children same ages to a john and mary?????

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/records.page/transcription/e1891household/24562587

think il lleave it for now as not hundred percent on it to be honest.......they both look equall to parents

I am not confused.
However, over the years, some of the replies and links have been deleted.
This is one of the other threads
http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.page/board/ancestors/hirst%20family/thread/1052487

In 1891 'Emxie' is down as the granddaughter of Thomas and Jane, and Electra is their daughter.
Then in 1881 and 1871 we have Electra as the daughter of Thomas and Jane
IN 1861 Thomas is the son of Arthur and Elizabeth, and in 1851 he is the son of Elizabeth, with her husband elsewhere on that day

1891 England Census
Thomas Hirst Age: 49 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1842
Relation: Head Spouse's Name: Jane Hirst
Gender: Male Where born: Elsecar, Yorkshire, England
Civil parish: Greasborough Ecclesiastical parish: Greasborough Town: Greasborough County/Island: Yorkshire Country: England
Street Address: Milton Arms Inn
Occupation: Blacksmith and Publican
Registration district: Rotherham Sub-registration district: Kimberworth
ED, institution, or vessel: 35 Piece: 3853 Folio: 80A Page Number: 8
Thomas Hirst 49 head
Jane Hirst 48 wife
Elector Hirst 21 dau
Betsy Hirst 16 dau
Kate Hirst 12 dau
Jane Hirst 9 dau
Ridgie Hirst 6 dau
Emzie Hirst 1 grndau
Larriett Wilcock 24 lodger
Arthur Hirst 23 son single
Source Citation: Class: RG12; Piece: 3853; Folio 80A; Page 8; GSU roll: 6098963.

1881 England Census
Thomas Hirst Age: 38 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1843
Relation: Head Spouse's Name: Jane Hirst
Gender: Male Where born: Elsecar, Yorkshire, England
Civil parish: Wombwell County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England Street Address: 7 Mitchells Terrace Condition as to marriage: Married Occupation: Colliery Smith
Registration district: Barnsley Sub-registration district: Darfield
ED, institution, or vessel: 5 Piece: 4606 Folio: 153 Page Number: 21
Thomas Hirst 38
Jane Hirst 37
Arthur Hirst 13 son
Electra Hirst 11 dau
Horace Hirst 9 son
Elizabeth Hirst 7 dau
Betsy Hirst 6 dau
Edith Hirst 2 dau
Kate Hirst 1 dau
Source Citation: Class: RG11; Piece: 4606; Folio: 153; Page: 21; GSU roll: 1342112.

1871 England Census
Thomas Hirst Age: 28 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1843
Relation: Head Spouse's Name: Jane Hirst
Gender: Male Where born: Elsecar, Yorkshire, England Civil parish: Wombwell Ecclesiastical parish: Elsecar County/Island: Yorkshire Country: England Registration district: Barnsley Sub-registration district: Darfield
ED, institution, or vessel: 7 Household schedule number: 60 Piece: 4650 Folio: 10 Page Number: 13
Thomas Hirst 28 Blacksmith
Jane Hirst 27
Lucy Hirst 5 dau
Arther Hirst 3 son
Elestar Hirst 1 dau
Source Citation: Class: RG10; Piece: 4650; Folio: 10; Page: 13; GSU roll: 848412.

1861 England Census
Thomas Hirst Age: 18 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1843
Relation: Son Father's Name: Alfred Hirst Mother's name: Elizabeth Hirst
Gender: Male Where born: Elsecar, Yorkshire, England Civil parish: Nether Hoyland Ecclesiastical parish: Elsecar County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England Street Address: Reform Row
Occupation: Smith Mineral Yard
Registration district: Barnsley Sub-registration district: Darfield
ED, institution, or vessel: 7 Household schedule number: 60 Piece: 3451 Folio: 10 Page Number: 13
Alfred Hirst 44
Elizabeth Hirst 44
Elizabeth Hirst 23
Thomas Hirst 18
William Hirst 14
Mary Hirst 11
Catherine Hirst 9
Ada Hirst 1
Source Citation: Class: RG9; Piece: 3451; Folio: 10; Page: 13; GSU roll: 543134.

1851 England Census
Thomas Hurst Age: 8 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1843
Relation: Son Mother's name: Elizabeth Hurst
Gender: M (Male) Where born: Elsecar, Yorkshire, England
Civil parish: Hoyland Nether Town: Hoyland County/Island: Yorkshire Country: England
Street Address: Reform Row Occupation: scholar
Registration district: Barnsley Sub-registration district: Darfield
ED, institution, or vessel: 4b Household schedule number: 184 Piece: 2333 Folio: 142 Page Number: 52
Elizabeth Hurst 35 head married
Jane Hurst 10
Thomas Hurst 8
Arthur Hurst 6
William Hurst 4
Mary Hurst 1
Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece: 2333; Folio: 142; Page: 52; GSU roll: 87577.

sorry, im still finding that John and mary are the parents of electra/eliza hirst

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/records.page/transcription/e1861household/16975208?searchhistorykey=33012308&surname=hirst&forename=frank

im not convinced that thomas and jane are , as i cannot find any more links that link up the rest of the children to whos parents they have.................

still i might be wrong

what year was thomas born??? im lost

No, Thomas would be 27 when Electra was born.

that would of made thomas 13 when he had electra?????? can this be right

thank you so very much Patchem. ill work on that for now...........

i know some people jump the gun and post some things i dont really need , or already know and then they go off scale, and sometimes that then gets confusing in itself .

sleep tight speak another time, and thanks xxx

Frank is in the family that you posted the reference to in 1891.
That is probably the wrong family.

Inse's Mother is Electra (1870), and Inse (1889) is probably illegitimate.
Electra's parents are Thomas (1843) and Jane.
Thomas's (1843) parents could be Alfred (1817) and Elizabeth.

Possibles for Alfred and Elizabeth in 1841
1841 England Census
: Alford Hurst Age: 25 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1816
Gender: Male Where born: Yorkshire, England
Civil parish: Wath Upon Dearne
Hundred: Strafforth and Tickhill (North Division)
County/Island: Yorkshire Country: England
Street Address: Reform Row, Elsecar
Occupation: coal miner
Registration district: Rotherham Sub-registration district: Wath
Piece: 1329 Book: 10 Folio: 5 Page Number: 3
Alford Hurst 25
Elizabeth Hurst 25
Elizabeth Hurst 3
Jane Hurst 1
Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece 1329; Book: 10; Civil Parish: Wath Upon Dearne; County: Yorkshire; Enumeration District: 8a; Folio: 5; Page: 3; Line: 5; GSU roll: 464277.

Elizabeth is married in 1851, Alfred elsewhere?
1851 England Census
Elizabeth Hurst Age: 35 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1816
Relation: Head Gender: F (Female) Where born: Hoyland, Yorkshire, England Civil parish: Hoyland Nether Town: Hoyland County/Island: Yorkshire Country: England
Registration district: Barnsley Sub-registration district: Darfield
ED, institution, or vessel: 4b Household schedule number: 184 Piece: 2333 Folio: 142 Page Number: 52
Elizabeth Hurst 35
Jane Hurst 10
Thomas Hurst 8
Arthur Hurst 6
William Hurst 4
Mary Hurst 1
Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece: 2333; Folio: 142; Page: 52; GSU roll: 87577.

oh my days all so confused now, think i will go to bed and return tomoz.................coz what i have on my tree is all so wrong then...............


getting to the no patients way out now, so mumbled jumled ,..................

who is the daughter of thomas and jane ???? inze or electra lol


ooops i bet im doing some heads in, any way you can answer, but then im leaving it for tonight, will swindle on summat else haha....


i appreciate all yr patients on here trying to help me out..............

xxxxxxx

Ps Frank Gibson born 1880 his father is jubal Gibson.............


in simple lame terms can you tell me the breakdown of the big list you sent me lol. why would frnak have a different surname ect.............. and did he marry twice also????

If Electra is Inse's Mother, she is the daughter of Thomas and Jane in 1871.

Thomas before marriage, (cannot load image to see if he is a blacksmith)?
1861 England Census
Thomas Hirst Age: 18 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1843
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Alfred Hirst Mother's name: Elizabeth Hirst
Gender: Male Where born: Elsecar, Yorkshire, England
Civil parish: Nether Hoyland Ecclesiastical parish: Elsecar
County/Island: Yorkshire Country: England
Registration district: Barnsley Sub-registration district: Darfield
ED, institution, or vessel: 7 Household schedule number: 60 Piece: 3451 Folio: 10 Page Number: 13
Alfred Hirst 44
Elizabeth Hirst 44
Elizabeth Hirst 23
Thomas Hirst 18
William Hirst 14
Mary Hirst 11
Catherine Hirst 9
Ada Hirst 1
Source Citation: Class: RG9; Piece: 3451; Folio: 10; Page: 13; GSU roll: 543134.