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Lost for Words ;-)
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16 Oct 2008 22:41 |
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These are the marriages 1855-62
No Year Surname (M) Forename (M) Surname (F) Forename (F) District City/County/MR GROS Data Image Extract
1 1858 MURDOCH ROBERT ALEXANDER VIOLET KILMARNOCK /AYR 597/00 0027
2 1858 MURDOCH ROBERT HOUSTON JANET TRADESTON GLASGOW CITY/LANARK 644/09 0009
3 1858 MURDOCH ROBERT KNIGHT MARY DUNNOTTAR /KINCARDINE 255/00 0010
4 1857 MURDOCH ROBERT MCKELLAR JANE LESMAHAGOW /LANARK 649/00 0025
5 1859 MURDOCH ROBERT MURPHY JANET STEWARTON /AYR 616/00 0029
6 1862 MURDOCH ROBERT PITHIE MARY DUNNOTTAR /KINCARDINE 255/00 0002
7 1855 MURDOCH ROBERT STRONACH CATHERINE NAIRN BURGH /NAIRN 123/01 0007
8 1862 MURDOCH ROBERT SUTHERLAND BATHIA NEW DEER /ABERDEEN 225/00 0021
9 1856 MURDOCH ROBERT URQUHART ELIZA KETTLE /FIFE 435/00 0001
10 1859 MURDOCH ROBERT WILLISON ISABELLA TRADESTON GLASGOW CITY/LANARK 644/09 0014
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Susan
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16 Oct 2008 22:36 |
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The second one- to Mary Allen is worse than useless. It just gives names and date and states both in this parish.
The third one- to Janet Sneddon can be ruled out I think ( well maybe not because Robert has shown to be a bit of a "stranger to the truth") as it states that both were born in this parish. Apart from that again just names and dates.
Scottish parish records were not that full of information unlike what I have seen on FreeBMD for English marriages.
Susan
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Susan
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16 Oct 2008 22:22 |
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Hi Carole
Well here goes with the first one- not a huge amount of help I am afraid but its a start
Blast wont let me copy paste so will type out the entry. This is from the parish register.
County Ayr
Parish Coylton
1853
May 28th. Robert Murdoch and Mary Richardson both in this parish gave in their names to be proclaimed in order to marriage and were married 1st June following.
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Carole
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16 Oct 2008 21:22 |
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I am at my computer and I keep checking in but I am also doing some research.
Carole
23:16 here in Spain
I have made no progress whatsoever in the last couple of hours!
I have had a busy gardening day today and I am shattered, so I'm signing off now.
Please don't give up on me.
Carole
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Carole
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16 Oct 2008 00:39 |
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I am really grateful for the help this evening. We may not have discovered much yet, but we have set the stage.
I hope you are up for joining me again tomorrow evening but I can't be around until after 8 pm?
It is 20 to 2 in the morning here now, so I am calling it a day.
Thanks
Carole
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Carole
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16 Oct 2008 00:11 |
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Susan
Don't go back to work too soon!!
We have all done it.
Sorry that my slow typing caused me to miss you.
Hope you feel better soon!
Carole
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Carole
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16 Oct 2008 00:08 |
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Gosh!! 1575!! Impressive stuff!!
I have delved back to about 1600 with my husband's family but efforts to trace my lot back, falls far short of that! Mountainous Brick Walls!
OK!! As you are sure. If you have enough credits; let's make a start with the three marriage records? As they are all pre 1855 they will have to be OPRs which sadly, usually gives less information:-
Mary Richardson 01/06/1853 Coylton, Ayrshire
Mary Allen 01/01/1854 St Ninians Stirling
Janet Sneddon 07/05/1853 Slamannan Stirling
Any other suggestions??? I'm not really au fait with Scottish searching and what is feasible and available?
Huge thanks for this
Carole
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Susan
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15 Oct 2008 23:59 |
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Will have to do any searches tomorrow- am off work ill and am kind of tired. May be in the evening- I hope ( haha) to go back to work tomorrow.
Happy hunting all
Regards
Susan
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Susan
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15 Oct 2008 23:42 |
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Sure Carole
Give me dates names ect and i will search-I have the spare scotland ppl cause I have taken my people as far back as I can go on there ( 1575 is earliest) so dont mind using them for appreciative people.
Regards
Susan
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Carole
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15 Oct 2008 23:38 |
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Susan
That is incredibly generous of you!!!
I really don't know what to say; it is such a waste if one makes a wrong choice! I pretty much agree with your reasoning for Mary Richardson; so if you are absolutely sure you don't mind ... go for it. ... but maybe we should check Family Search first?
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Carole
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15 Oct 2008 23:29 |
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Right Julie first
Jane was living in Tranent in Haddingtonshire. She was married to a David Montgomery, 20 years her senior. They had married in 1850. They had four children. Interestingly, the last child, born in 1859, was named Robert Murdoch Montgomery (suspicious or what?) After his birth record, no one has been able to discover what happened to the child? (But that is another story)
Sometime after the birth of Robert, and before 3rd January 1862, Jane fled the nest, either with, or to join, Robert in Durham... David died in 1870 which should have freed Jane to marry Robert. Why didn't she??
Most of the above has been dealt with in previous threads so please don't waste hours of your valuable time on the Montgomerys. ... but it can be useful to know the background?
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Carole
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15 Oct 2008 23:20 |
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Oops
I think we were all typing away at about the same time!
Sorry! I'll read what you both have to say; digest and get back to you
Carole
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Carole
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15 Oct 2008 23:17 |
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Thanks Susan
Everything Helps!!!
But I think I may have to toss a coin?
If Julie is right about the Robert in the 1851 census, being a coach driver in Stirling, it adds a couple more options.
07/05/1853 - Janet Sneddon - Slamannan, Stirling.
01/01/1854 - Mary Allen - St Ninians, Stirling.
plus every eligible girl along his route?
Sterling is possible, as Jane lived in Haddingtonshire; not a million miles from Sterling.
Hmmmmm!!!!???
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Susan
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15 Oct 2008 23:09 |
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I have a few more credits for Scotlands people so if you give me some manes ect to work with will search for you.
Regards
Susan
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Jooleh
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15 Oct 2008 23:00 |
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I thought that too! They're not on Free BMD so you might want to try Scotlands people for a match. Incidentally was Jane living in Scotland with her first family as her whereabouts could have a bearing on where they met/where he was living?
oops posted at the same time as Susan but this was a reply to Carole's previous text
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Susan
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15 Oct 2008 22:57 |
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Hi
The following are the list of marriages from Scotlands People
31/01/1851 MURDOCH ROBERT JANET BROWN/FR898 M Ochiltree /AYR 609/ 0040 0199 VIEW (5 CREDITS) ORDER
2 19/01/1851 MURDOCH ROBERT JANET BROWN/FR398 M Auchinleck /AYR 577/ 0020 0352 VIEW (5 CREDITS) ORDER
3 17/12/1853 MURDOCH ROBERT JANET WYLLIE/FR959 M Stewarton /AYR 616/ 0040 0420 VIEW (5 CREDITS) ORDER
4 17/12/1853 MURDOCH ROBERT JANET WYLLIE/FR633 M Dunlop /AYR 591/ 0030 0229 VIEW (5 CREDITS) ORDER
01/06/1853 MURDOCH ROBERT MARY RICHARDSON/FR605 M Coylton /AYR 583/ 0030 0246
FYI Ochiltree and Coylton are adjacent parishes to Stair. If I had to make a guess I would opt for the last marriage there- The Coylton one as Nos 1 and 2 are the same couple in their repective parishes as are Nos 3 and 4.
May help a little
Regards
Susan
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Carole
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15 Oct 2008 22:35 |
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Hello again Julie
I'm beginning to warm to your second find.
The Robert is the correct age, he was born in Stair: ...I was put off by the Morshire, when it should be Ayrshire but I don't think Morshire exists?? .. so maybe it is a transcription error?
I don't suppose it took any great training to drive a coach, particularly for a farm boy; so although he did not remain a coach driver, he might have been one for a while?
A long shot but I wonder if he married the 16 year old girl, Mary Maham (This puzzle is really getting to me and I really am clutching at straws now!!! )
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Carole
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15 Oct 2008 22:01 |
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I have just unearthed Robert's OPR birth record.
Definitely born 1829 Aug 10th, baptised 25th.
Definitely born at Barbeth Farm. The register was for the Parish of Stair, Ayrshire.
The 1841 census has him, age 10, at the farm, with his father and his sister Margaret, age 20 and brother William age 15.
The farm passed out of the Murdoch family in 1849 but James Candles continued to live there until his death in 1850.
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Carole
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15 Oct 2008 21:26 |
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Hi again Moody Blue
Sad! It doesn't work! Initially it looked so promising!
Robert and Jane were definitely in Durham for the 1871 census. There is no doubt that it is the correct family unit, despite the fact that they call themselves Petticrew and not Murdoch/k. Their twin daughters are the deciding factor, Sarah and Margaret! .. born Jarrow Jan 1862.
Their five children were Sarah, Margaret, Robert, Christopher and Henry. .. Sarah, my great grandmother, I know a lot about. Also Christoper and Henry. Jane, their mother, and her 'other' family are also quite well documented. It is Robert, pre 1862, who I need to discover more about?
Carole
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Carole
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15 Oct 2008 21:08 |
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Hi Moody Blue
Robert and Isabella! I wonder?? I agree about the names.
To still be in Scotland for the 1861 census is cutting it fine; but not impossible. ... and I have found no evidence of his being in England in 1861. .. I suppose the thing is to see if that family unit still contained Robert sen. in subsequent censuses??
Thanks
Carole
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