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Janey
You're right.

Florence might have been told that her mother died ( must buy that cert. I guess) and the really kind grandson of her employers took pity on the baby and decided to raise her........

Who knows ?

I'm off to 'walk around the village in 1881 ' and see who was living where, because although not born at the 1881 census address, I do recognise the house name where Florence was born on New Year's Day 1882.
Perhaps someone in the extended family looked after her until Edward married.

Many thanks for your help finding Florence for me.

Gwyn

So there's that edge all tidied indeed!

Still possible that Florence herself didn't know he was her father - Florence probably never had a birth certificate. Or her paternity may have been for family ears only, if Edward's wife thought it scandalous, for instance. There always has to be something left unexplained, doesn't there? ;)

Well !

Today I received a copy of the birth certificate for Florence WAGSTAFF....and what a bonus....
The informant is shown as Edward H SKERRETT, father

I was hoping that perhaps one of the Skerretts was the informant, but to find it was Edward stating he was the father was a real plus.

Which leaves the question, ...Why did Florence not name him when she married?.......
but at least I can give her a definite place in my tree now.

Gwyn

Thanks for your thoughts, Janey.

Florence was my, ....let me see, ..1st cousin twice removed, so not close, but if she was Edward's daughter we have a bloodlink so I am interested in 'tidying the edges'.

I checked back on her supposed birth mother's family on census records and I think that by the time baby Florence was born, her mother Elizabeth's own mother had died and her father remarried and lived elsewhere in Herefordshire, so they were unlikely to take in an illegitimate grandchild.

Still wondering if Florence was born at the home of Edward's grandparents., James and Ann WOOD, my 3 x G grandparents. The trouble is that it's such a small village that a birth certificate might only name the village rather than full address.....and is that where Elizabeth Wagstaff died too?

Might have to spend a bit more to close this story.......

Gwyn

'Course I agree. I made it up myself! Beating Fanny to it only by virtue of her desperate need to bathe. ;)

I think maybe "unknown" was a way of avoiding having a father with a different surname, although one wouldn't think "unknown" was much better! It could be that she really was never told that he was her father.

It could be that he wasn't, but it would be hard to explain him rearing the child of his parents' employee, and her apparently using his surname socially, otherwise.

I hadn't tried to trace her mother any further back -- she seemed to be the only person with that surname in the vicinity at the time of Florence's birth, so maybe she had no family who might otherwise have taken the baby in. No direct relation to you I guess, so not a burning question. ;)

UPDATE
Well....the marriage certificate for Florence to Alphas PULLEN has arrived today.
Mixed result really.... It has 'unknown' for Florence's father.
Didn't anyone tell her?
She lived with him in 1891, for goodness sake !

She married in Whitbourne, Herefordshire in 1902 ( where Edward and his family were in 1901)
Was he at the wedding in his village, I wonder............

One bonus is that a Ruth SKERRETT was a witness ( possibly Edward's sister)

SO
I can link her to the family, I think, because it would be too much coincidence for all these pieces of jigsaw to fit, in different parts of the country, including Wales, unless this Florence getting married is the same person.

Do you all agree?

Gwyn

You're very welcome! Hadn't seen a proper mysterious ancestor in a while so this one filled the gap nicely. ;)

Fan
Thank you for the extra information .That's great.
I couldn't have done this without all the willing help from fellow members.

Many thanks.

Gwyn

Fanny bows to Janey,yet again......sigh......

Cheer up Fan,she didnt find the death of Aubrey N,,,you did.
Fan blows on fingernails........

Just got out of the bath and had this on my screen before I got in,,,coincidences or what?
As she was one of the two born Ullingswick ,but wanted my bath more than research at the time.

PULLEN, Alphaus Head Married M 28 1883 Waggoner On Farm Whitbourne Herefordshire
PULLEN, Florence Wife Married
9 years F 29 1882 Ullingswick Herefordshire
PULLEN, Reginald Alphas Son M 8 1903 School Ullingswick Herefordshire


Address:
Bringsty Worcester
Registration District:
Bromyard

Back with the Catherine /Edward one in a mo.

Watch this space
>>>>

Address:
Near Huntlands Whitbourne Worcester
Registration District:
Bromyard

SKERRETT, Edward Head Married M 50 1861 Cowman On Farm Ullingswick Herefordshire
SKERRETT, Catherine Wife Married
26 years F 48 1863 Charwoman Hatfield Herefordshire
SKERRETT, Charles Son Single M 15 1896 House-Boy At Gentleman's House Herefordshire Bredenbury
SKERRETT, Lucy Daughter F 12 1899 School Herefordshire Whitbourne


Another choice of birthplace for Catherine?but still in Hereford.
Make a triangle of the 3 and maybe she was born in the middle ??

A really big THANKYOU.
I have been looking for Florence for years.........

So all the time I was thinking she was probably Catherine's illegitimate child, she really belonged to Edward.
So sad that her mother died so young.
I think I'll buy some certs. in the hope that a link might show, but the baptism is my best hope, I think.

What a good day's work.
I am so grateful .

Many thanks to all for their input.

Gwyn

I was editing. ;)

Looks like they moved to Worcestershire and I would bet that 1958 death is her.

I think there's little doubt that's her, Florence Wagstaff.

The birth cert undoubtedly says only the mother's name. But if the mother died in childbirth, maybe a baptismal record will give some other names too? Then there's the marriage cert, but that's probably not going to be much help.

Wow Janey
I was just about to post and say "Thanks, but leave it for tonight" and here you are with an amazing find.

How can I prove this?
I wonder if there's anything on Florence WAGSTAFF's baptism record ?

I think I'm going to need to go to Herefordshire and study the books.....
It really does look as if you've found her.

All I've got to do now is find what happened to her.
Edit
Oh, ..a death

Gwyn

Florence's household in 1911, just to get it on record here:

Her husband:
PULLEN ALPHAUS 1883 28 Bromyard Herefordshire
and children:
PULLEN REGINALD ALPHAS 1903 8
PULLEN REGENALD GEORGE 1904 7
PULLEN HORACE ALFRED 1905 6
and a spare person:
PULLEN ALFRED GEORGE M 1877 34

No kids born after 1911, it seems.

Looks like the husband's death:

Name: Alphas Pullen
Death Registration Month/Year: 1962
Age at death (estimated): 79
Registration district: Worcester
Inferred County: Worcestershire
Volume: 9d
Page: 240

but I'm not finding a death for Florence.

Is this a possible (in the classic mode of having the birthday right but the year wrong)?

Name: Florence Pullen
Birth Date: 4 Mar 1884
Death Registration Month/Year: 1970
Registration district: Sutton
Inferred County: Greater London
Volume: 5e
Page: 617

or maybe more likely

Name: Florence Pullen
Death Registration Month/Year: 1958
Age at death (estimated): 76
(death was in Q1 1958 so that would fit)
Registration district: Martley
Inferred County: Worcestershire
Volume: 9d
Page: 182

Florence Pullen in 1911 =

Marriages Sep 1902
Pullen Alphas Bromyard 6a 1197
Wagstaff Florence Bromyard 6a 1197

Births Mar 1882
Wagstaff Florence Bromyard 6a 549

Exactly the right age ...


I see no Florence Wagstaff in Herefordshire in 1891 or 1901.

In 1881 we have:

Name: Elizabeth Wagstaff
Age: 19
Estimated birth year: abt 1862
Relation: Servant
Gender: Female
Where born: Ullingswick, Hereford, England

Civil parish: Ullingswick
County/Island: Herefordshire
Country: England

Street Address: Steps House

James Wood 65
Annie Wood 71
>>> Edward H. Wood 19
James Went 45
Elizabeth Wagstaff 19


Deaths Mar 1882 -- died in childbirth?
WAGSTAFF Elizabeth 20 Bromyard 6a 375


My my my. I think maybe I've dunnit. ;)


To summarize:

Florence was the daughter of Edward Henry Skerrett and Elizabeth Wagstaff, a servant in the household of Edward's grandparents Wood in 1881.

"Ullingsworth" -- I completely made that up, didn't I?

And yet Herbert answered to it in 1911. ;)

Makes my 1911 searches to date worthless though, I think. (I don't have access but Fanny does, for what you requested there, so be patient.)

No Florence, and nobody with surname beginning with S, answers to born in Ullingswick in 1911.

edit

Aaaargh. I had forgotten to clear something from my search form.

Two Florences of about the right age, born in Ullingswick, in 1911:

BAYLISS FLORENCE 1883 28 Aston Warwickshire

PULLEN FLORENCE 1882 29 Bromyard Herefordshire


Also

SKERRETT EDWARD 1861 50 Bromyard Herefordshire

and

SKERRETT ELIZABETH 1840 71 Bromyard Herefordshire
SKERRETT HERBERT 1837 74 Bromyard Herefordshire
SKERRETT HAROLD 1892 19 Bromyard Herefordshire
SKERRETT JACK 1903 8 Bromyard Herefordshire
SKERRETT ROSE ELLEN 1890 21 Tewkesbury Gloucestershire
SKERRETT ELIZABETH MAUD 1870 41 Walsingham Norfolk

Is anyone able to tell me what is shown as Catherine's birthplace in 1911 please.? She is in Bromyard district.
Please don't use up credits.

She gives 2 differing places in 1891 and 1901.

I'm not sure they really know anyway.
I'm fairly sure that in 1901 the son Henry,age 10 b. Wacton, Herefordshire is really Edward Henry b. Blaengarw, Wales
( He is back to Edward Henry on cert. when he married in 1911 )

Name: Henry Sherrett
Age: 10
Estimated birth year: abt 1891
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Edward
Mother's Name: Catherine
Gender: Male
Where born: Wacton, Herefordshire, England

Civil parish: Whitbourne
Ecclesiastical parish: St John Baptist
Town: Whitbourne
County/Island: Herefordshire
Country: England


Registration district: Bromyard
Sub-registration district: Brockhampton
ED, institution, or vessel: 10
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 68
Household Members: Name Age
Edward Sherrett 39
Catherine Sherrett 38
Herbert Sherrett 15
Rose Sherrett 12
>>>Henry Sherrett 10
Charles Sherrett 5
Lucy Sherrett 2


Source Citation: Class: RG13; Piece: 2491; Folio: 81; Page: 10.

If they can't remember where their own children are born, I'm not sure if they'd know their own birthplace.



Gwyn

Nope -- 1881:

Harcourt Vaughan 46
>> Occupation: Income From Int Of Moy & Rents
Hannah Vaughan 39
Mary Stone 34 - sister-in-law
Civil parish: Hentland
County/Island: Herefordshire

So this would explain Catherine being in a boarding school in 1881 (with that huge long list of extraneous names!!).

I'd found the Harcourt Vaughan + Hannah Stone marriage --

Marriages Mar 1863
STONE Hannah Hereford 6a 685
VAUGHAN Harcourt Hereford 6a 685

-- but Harcourt at least didn't die until 1887, in Islington.

Could be Hannah? --

Deaths Jun 1868
VAUGHAN Hannah 27 Weobly 6a 317
(there's a mistranscription in the vol/page)

which could explain the children being with the aunt and uncle.

I'm back....Thank you for your help everyone.
I'm just going to take a look at all those Catherines.

I have a note from Vital Records for a baptism of a Catherine Frances bapt Peterstow, March 1865, the daughter of Harcourt VAUGHAN and Hannah.
...I don't know if this connects to 'my' Catherine, but made a note while trawling for clues.

Gwyn