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Brilliant, thanks Catherine - according to the census records I have Mary Ann was born in 1856 so I think that birth is more likely but I'll get the certificates and be sure to let you know.

Thanks again and have a lovely Christmas!!

Off to bed now, but do let us know the outcome if you do buy those certificates.
Merry Xmas
Catherine

The one born in 1851 has parents Samuel and Emma (from 1861 census).

The other one:-

1861
Name: Mary Ann Rout
Age: 5
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1856
Relation: Daughter
Mother's Name: Elizabeth Rout
Gender: Female
Where born: Norwich

Civil parish: Norwich St Mary At Coslany
County/Island: Norfolk
Country: England

Street Address:

Registration district: Norwich
Sub-registration district: Coslany
ED, institution, or vessel: 7
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 51
Piece: 1210
Folio: 123
Page Number: 9
Household Members:
Name Age
Elizabeth Rout 34 born: Norwich (married)
Elizabeth Rout 10
Mary Ann Rout 5
Clara Rout 3

......has mother Elizabeth, but father ?


This is a submitted entry from familysearch so needs confirming:-

Clara Rout - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Birth: 13 AUG 1857 Norwich, Norfolk, England
Father: William Rout
Mother: Elizabeth Ann Allen

Thanks for the tip on Mary Ann, Catherine...after Christmas spending is out of the way I will invest in those certificates as there's no point me just guessing if I want to take this seriously!

Thank you so much again, I really appreciate it!

Thanks so much Lesley and Catherine - this is brilliant!

I am going to find out some more info from my Granddad re: Ellen and hopefully narrow down which is the right family that way.

This is just all so fascinating, I am so grateful for your help!

There are two Mary Ann Rout's that could have married Edward Fenn:-

Births Sep 1850 (>99%)
Rout Mary Ann Norwich 13 249 S

Births Dec 1855 (>99%)
Rout Mary Ann Norwich 4b 84

..........so to be sure you follow the correct one, you should buy the marriage cert. to see who her father was and his occupation.
It will also give you her age so you can work out her date of birth.

Thanks for help Catherine :-) I'm going cross eyed so am off to bed

In 1851 Mary Ann Fenn is noted as being born in St.Saviour, Norwich, so this could be a possible birth:-

MARY ANN FENN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Birth: 31 OCT 1804
Gender: Female Christening: 11 NOV 1804 Saint Saviour, Norwich, Norfolk, England

Father: WILLIAM FENN
Mother: SARAH MIDDLETON

If this is correct, then these are possible siblings:-

EMILY FENN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Birth: 16 JUL 1807
Gender: Female Christening: 02 AUG 1807 St Saviours, Norwich, Norfolk, England

WILLIAM FENN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: 05 DEC 1809
Gender: Male Christening: 10 DEC 1809 St Saviors, Norwich, Norfolk, England

HENRY FENN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 29 JUN 1823 St Saviors, Norwich, Norfolk, England

SARAH FENN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 19 SEP 1813 St Saviours, Norwich, Norfolk, England

SAMUEL FENN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 25 AUG 1816 St Saviors, Norwich, Norfolk, England

(apart from Mary Ann, the others are all submitted entries)

1851 England Census about Emeline Fenn
Name: Emeline Fenn
Age: 17
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1834
Gender: F (Female)
Where born: Norwich; Heigham

Civil parish: Norwich Heigham
County/Island: Norfolk
Country: England

Street Address: New Field

Occupation: Laundress employing 2 women

Registration district: Norwich
Sub-registration district: West Wymer
ED, institution, or vessel: 8k
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 104
Piece: 1816
Folio: 438
Page Number: 24
Household Members:
Name Age
Mary A Fenn 46 born: Norwich, St Saviour
Emeline Fenn 17



1841
1841 England Census about Emiline Fenn
Name: Emiline Fenn
Age: 7
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1834
Gender: Female
Where born: Norfolk, England

Civil parish: Heigham
Hundred: Norwich
County/Island: Norfolk
Country: England

Registration district: Norwich
Sub-registration district: West Wymer
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 787
Book: 6
Folio: 37
Page Number: 22
Household Members:
Name Age
Mary Ann Fann 35 born: Norfolk, England
Emiline Fenn 7

I see what you mean Lesley...and Mary and Edward had Mary's brother living with them at one point...a William Rout born in 1866. I wonder where he fits in?

Marriages Mar 1927 (>99%)
FENN Arthur F NELSON Norwich 4b 239
Nelson Ellen E Fenn Norwich 4b 239

The marriage cert. will give you Ellen's father's name and occupation which will help you choose between the two possible births.


Births Jun 1858 (>99%)
Fenn Edward Norwich 4b 160

.......you may also need to buy the birth cert. of Edward to see who is parents were, just in case.

nudge

Yes that's possible, it's the children I'm finding confusing

:-S :-S :-S

Thanks Lesley - could Emma/Jemima have been mistranscribed somewhere?!

Somethings not right can someone double ckeck please


Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth
Year Occupation Where Born Original
census
image

ROUT, Samuel Head M 50 1821 Norfolk VIEW
ROUT, Jemima Wife F 45 1826 Norfolk VIEW
ROUT, Saml Son M 22 1849 Norfolk VIEW
ROUT, Louisa Daughter F 19 1852 Norfolk VIEW
ROUT, Amelia Daughter F 16 1855 Norfolk VIEW
ROUT, Susannah Daughter F 11 1860 Norfolk VIEW
Piece:
1822 Folio:
42 Page:
21 Registration District:
Norwich

Civil Parish:
Heigham Municipal Borough:
Norwich Address:
Armes Street, Heigham, Norwich County:
Norfolk

Well that is very interesting indeed, thank you so much Lesley for all your efforts!

It looks that way Rachel

1861
????????????????????????????

ROUT, Samuel Head Married M 42 1819 Hawker
Norwich
Norfolk VIEW
ROUT, Emma Wife Married F 36 1825
Norwich
Norfolk VIEW
ROUT, Samuel Son Unmarried M 12 1849 Hawker
Norwich
Norfolk VIEW
ROUT, Mary A Daughter Unmarried F 10 1851
Norwich
Norfolk VIEW
ROUT, Louisa Daughter Unmarried F 9 1852 Scholar
Norwich
Norfolk VIEW
ROUT, Amelia Daughter Unmarried F 5 1856 Scholar
Norwich
Norfolk VIEW
ROUT, Susanna Daughter F 0 (1M) 1861
Norwich
Norfolk VIEW
ROUT, Joseph Nephew Unmarried M 13 1848 Scholar
Norwich
Norfolk VIEW
ROUT, Michael Nephew Unmarried M 4 1857 Errand Boy
Norwich
Norfolk VIEW
Piece:
1211 Folio:
78 Page:
3 Registration District:
Norwich

Civil Parish:
St Augustine Municipal Borough:
Norwich Address:
Rose Yard, St Augustines, St Augustine, Norwich County:
Norfolk

Thanks Lesley - so am I right in guessing that Edward was illegitimate?!

Name: ROUT, Mary Ann
Registration District: Help Norwich
County: Norfolk
Year of Registration: 1855
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
Mother's Maiden Name: Not available before 1911 Q3
Volume No: Help 4B
Page No: Help 84
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