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don't think that 'W' is a ditto for Smith ?


Births Sep 1859 (>99%)
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SMITH Mary Sarah Wells Shoreditch 1c 154

In the 1871....Susan's daughter Mary is Born 1860 Shorditch.

??

1861 England Census
about Susan Smith
Name: Susan Smith
Age: 31
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1830
Relation: Lodger
Gender: Female
Where born: Walthan Stowe, Essex, England

Civil parish: Hackney St John
Ecclesiastical parish: West Hackney
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View image

Registration district: Hackney
Sub-registration district: West Hackney
ED, institution, or vessel: 17
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 93
Piece: 156
Folio: 151
Page Number: 18
Household Members: Name Age
Joseph Bouchard 28
S Bouchard 24
I Bouchard 6
Susan Smith 31 (Unmarried) Dress Maker
M S W Smith 1 (Daughter)....The "W" is a Ditto for Smith (Shorditch)

If we are on the right track..........and this is Susan and John's marriage.........then she should appear in 1861 as Smith.

Marriages Jun 1869 (>99%)

Smith Susan Shoreditch 1c 361
Wells John Shoreditch 1c 361

thanks all you help

will look in again tomorrow with fresh eyes !

sorry Prickly - think you might have found the right family -

no sign of Agnes Bertha with them though in 1871



1871 England Census

Name: Susan Wells
Age: 43
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1828
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: John Wells
Gender: Female
Where born: Walthamstow, Essex, England
Civil parish: St Leonard Shoreditch
Ecclesiastical parish: All Saints Haggerstone
County/Island: London
Country: England
Registration district: Shoreditch
Sub-registration district: Haggerston West
ED, institution, or vessel: 18
Household schedule number: 126
Piece: 466
Folio: 75
Page Number: 21
Household Members: Name Age
John Wells 40
Susan Wells 43
Mary Wells 11
John Wells 7
Ida Wells 3 (Ada on original)




Source Citation: Class: RG10; Piece: 466; Folio: 75; Page: 21; GSU roll: 823366.

I was just about to post that Choccy!

I have to leave now but will check back on here tomorrow.

Good luck. :-)

1881

WELLS, John Head Married M 50 1831 Cabinet Maker
St Neots
Huntingdonshire VIEW
>>>>>WELLS, Susan Wife Married F 53 1828
Walthamstow
Essex VIEW
WELLS, John O Son Single M 17 1864 Messenger
Shoreditch
Middlesex VIEW
>>>>>WELLS, Ada M Daughter Single F 13 1868
Shoreditch
Middlesex VIEW
>>>>>SMITH, Ethel Grandchild Single F 2 1879
Shoreditch
Middlesex VIEW

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Piece:
305 Folio:
75 Page:
14 Registration District:
Hackney

Civil Parish:
Hackney Municipal Borough:
Address:
132, Blurton Rd, Hackney County:
London, Middlesex

I don't know if there is a clue here......but Ada M Wells is down as "Sister in Law"....Single...Housekeeper.


1891 England Census
about Agnes B Marshall
Name: Agnes B Marshall
Age: 35
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1856
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Alfred W Marshall
Gender: Female
Where born: Walthamstow, Essex, England

Civil parish: St Marylebone
Ecclesiastical parish: All Souls
Town: London
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: Marylebone
Sub-registration district: All Souls
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 90
Folio: 39
Page Number: 20
Household Members: Name Age
Alfred W Marshall 45
Agnes B Marshall 35
Alfred H Marshall 10
William E Marshall 8
Ada M Wells 22 >>>> Kingsland London
Lilias Wishart 30
Sarah Lasar 54
Mary Gilhooley 27
Bridget Flye 28
Eliza Lehamy 23
Annis Flyn 28
Bridgeh Gilhooly 24

Wikipedia -


'Marshall was born in Walthamstow. Her father, John Smith, was a clerk, but died when she was young and his widow, Susan, remarried'

'Marshall's early life remains obscure, but it was later written in the Pall Mall Gazette that she studied cooking from an early age, and "practised at Paris and with Vienna's celebrated chefs"'

The Agnes in the family is the right age to be who i'm looking for.

Thanks

1861 this one has a father called John

Name: Bartha Smith
Age: 2
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1859
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: John Smith
Mother's Name: Hannah Smith
Gender: Female
Where born: Springfield, Essex, England

Civil parish: Springfield
County/Island: Essex
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View image

Registration district: Chelmsford
Sub-registration district: Great Baddow
ED, institution, or vessel: 1d
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 90
Piece: 1082
Folio: 11
Page Number: 16
Household Members: Name Age
John Smith 31
Hannah Smith 26
Agnes Smith 7
Grace Smith 3
Bartha Smith 2
William Green 24
Henry Archer 40



BUT you really need the marriage cert

No I dont have a certificate, I was told be someone but I know they were married in 1878 St George Hanover

1861 just posting while having a look around

Name: Artha Smith
Age: 7
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1854
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Joseph Smith
Mother's Name: May M Smith
Gender: Female
Where born: Walthamstow, Essex, England

Civil parish: Walthamstow
County/Island: Essex
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View image

Registration district: West Ham
Sub-registration district: Walthamstow
ED, institution, or vessel: 3
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 75
Piece: 1061
Folio: 46
Page Number: 15
Household Members: Name Age
Joseph Smith 40 - Chelford - think it is Chingford - gardener
May M Smith 32 - Walthamstow
Edmond J Smith 14
Emily Smith 9
Artha Smith 7
Sabina Smith 4
Alice E Smith 2

Class: RG 9; Piece: 1061; Folio: 46; Page: 15; GSU roll: 542745.

Could it be Bertha ??

How do you know her Fathers name is John?

Do you have her marriage cert?

If so, what was her Fathers occupation please?

Thank you for your help

Thank you. any way of finding out about her family before she was married?

not finding her birth?



found the following -

http://www.canalmuseum.org.uk/ice/marshall.htm


Mrs A.B. Marshall
Agnes Marshall, Queen of Ice Cream


'Mrs. Agnes Bertha Marshall (1855 - 1905) was a celebrity cook, equivalent to today's television stars of cookery, who demonstrate and write books, and are personality performers. Had there been television in her day, Mrs. Marshall would have without question been a cookery "guru" on the small screen - she was always keen to adopt new technology. Agnes Marshall wrote four books:-
•The Book of Ices 1885
•Mrs. A.B. Marshall's Book of Cookery 1888
•Mrs. A.B. Marshall's Larger Cookery Book of Extra Recipes 1891
•Fancy Ices 1894
and these are considered to be some of the finest books of their type ever written, especially those on ices, of which Mrs. Marshall was the Queen. Her recipes are clear, accurate, and well illustrated. Mrs. Marshall has been neglected by historians, and is not famous today, unlike Mrs. Beeton, whose work benefited from commercial promotion long after her death. In contrast Mrs. Marshall's family did not make a long term success of her business which included a cookery school, sales of equipment, and invention of machines.
She ran a domestic staff agency business, sold domestic and cooking equipment, and ran a successful school of cookery. She campaigned for better standards of food hygiene. In 1886 she started a magazine called "The Table". Agnes toured extensively, lecturing and demonstrating her techniques to huge audiences. Mrs. Marshall can be credited with the invention of the ice cream edible cone, mentioned in her 1888 cookery book, the recipe being "cornets with cream". This predates American claims to the invention in 1904! There are no known earlier references to the edible ice cream cone which nowadays we all take for granted.Her books stimulated demand for imported Norwegian ice which was supplied from the building which is now the London Canal Museum. An exhibition at Syon House (1998) and at London Canal Museum (1999) told the story of her amazing life, which, sadly, ended at the age of only 49'

Deaths Sep 1905 (>99%)
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MARSHALL Agnes Bertha 50 Hendon 3a 108