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jerseylily
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3 Jun 2012 10:27 |
I have Isaac in the 1881, 1891, 1901 and 1911 censuses, always in West Bromwich, but cannot find him in 1871.
From the census returns he was born in 1862 in West Bromwich, Staffordshire and from his 1882 marriage certificate his father's name was William. Isaac was an Iron Worker and William a Labourer.
In 1881 Isaac is a boarder in the home of Ann Moore (1829 Nottingham) but I haven't been able to establish if there is any relationship, ditto with the Moore family living next door.
There are no Isaac Moores born in West Brom in 1862 but there is one in 1863 and 2 in 1864.
Any input would be much appreciated
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Susan
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3 Jun 2012 10:37 |
Age is a little out .
1871 England Census about Isaac Moore Name: Isaac Moore Age: 6 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1865 Relation: Son Father's Name: Ed Moore Mother's name: Sarah Moore Gender: Male Where born: West Bromwich, Staffordshire, England Civil parish: Linthorpe County/Island: Yorkshire Country: England Registration district: Stockton Sub-registration district: Yarm ED, institution, or vessel: 36 Household schedule number: 83 Piece: 4898 Folio: 39 Page Number: 17 Household Members: Name Age Ed Moore 32 Sarah Moore 32 William Moore 11 Sarah A Moore 8 Isaac Moore 6 Elizabeth Moore 3 Eliza Moore 1 Edward Cashmore 28 Edit Sorry father not William in this Census
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brummiejan
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3 Jun 2012 10:42 |
I can't see him at all - there is a William Moore labourer in 1881, born 1831, which would seem ideal if we could link them! The only other thing I can think of - aside from the family being missed off the census - is that his mother might have been living with another man, married or otherwise, and Isaac was going under that name in 1871. I have seen this often when doing lookups. Who were the witnesses to his marriage? Jan
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Susan
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3 Jun 2012 10:48 |
England & Wales, FreeBMD Birth Index, 1837-1915 about Isaac Moore Name: Isaac Moore Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1863 Registration district: West Bromwich Inferred County: Shropshire, Staffordshire, Warwickshire, Worcestershire Volume: 6b Page: 698
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Susan
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3 Jun 2012 10:50 |
Who did he marry please.
1891 England Census about Isaac Moore Name: Isaac Moore Age: 29 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1862 Relation: Son-in-law Gender: Male Where born: West Bromwich, Staffordshire, England Civil parish: West Bromwich Ecclesiastical parish: St John County/Island: Staffordshire Country: England Street Address:
Occupation:
Condition as to marriage:
Education:
Employment status: View image Registration district: West Bromwich Sub-registration district: West Bromwich South West ED, institution, or vessel: 12 Neighbors: View others on page Piece: 2268 Folio: 109 Page Number: 16 Household Members: Name Age William Blizzard 65 Isaac Moore 29 Charlotte Blizzard 28 John W Moore 8 Ann E Moore 7 Isaac Moore 3 Samuel Moore 1
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Susan
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3 Jun 2012 10:56 |
Only one I can see that has Father as William..and is an Iron worker
1881 England Census about Isaac Moore Name: Isaac Moore Age: 15 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1866 Relation: Son Father's Name: William Moore Mother's name: Jane Moore Gender: Male Where born: Oldbury Civil parish: Oldbury County/Island: Worcestershire Country: England Street Address: 19 Stone St Education:
Employment status: View image Occupation: Ironworker Registration district: West Bromwich Sub-registration district: Oldbury ED, institution, or vessel: 18 Neighbors: View others on page Piece: 2840 Folio: 60 Page Number: 9 Household Members: Name Age William Moore 48 Jane Moore 45 Saml. Moore 25 George Moore 21 Isaac Moore 15 Hannah Moore 6 William Moore 4 Hannah Cartwright 68 Mothers maiden name (William snr ) Mathew Gorer 50
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jerseylily
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3 Jun 2012 11:28 |
Isaac married Charlotte Blizzard, unfortunately I don't have the marriage certificate with me (playing Jubilee Granny for a few days) so I don't know who the witnesses were.
I'm quite liking the look of that 1881 that you found Susan, I was never sure of the one I had even though mine was born in 1862 and worked as a Puddler. There are a few discrepancies tho', especially the age which is consistent in the censuses that I have found, and also the occupation of the father.
Looking at Hannah Cartwright in the 1871, who is described as William's mother in 1881, William is living with her, married and a labourer, but no wife or children are present. I'll have to try and trace them, if only to eliminate.
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Susan
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3 Jun 2012 11:51 |
England & Wales, FreeBMD Marriage Index: 1837-1915 about Isaac Moore Name: Isaac Moore Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1882 Registration district: West Bromwich Inferred County: Staffordshire Volume Number: 6b Page Number: 862 Isacc's Father in the 1881 census is a coal miner
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brummiejan
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3 Jun 2012 12:08 |
As the census took place around the beginning of April, if his birthday is after this date, the 1863 birth would fit. If you have no more luck you might need to chance it. He is consistent with his age on each census so it's a reasonable gamble. Have you found the other 2 Isaac's in 1881? Come back when you have the witnesses' names, with a bit of luck they will help! Jan
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LadyKira
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3 Jun 2012 12:12 |
In 1861 there are 2 Williams.
1861 census Address: Stone Street, Oldbury MOORE, William Head Married M 27 1834 Coal Miner Coventry, Warwickshire MOORE, Jane Wife Married F 25 1836 London Paddington MOORE, Samuel Son M 5 1856 Scholar Oldbury, Worcestershire MOORE, George H Son M 1 1860 Oldbury, Worcestershire SKIDMORE, Mercy Boarder F 15 1846 Nailor Oldbury, Worcestershire
This one fits in with the 1881 Susan found and the address is the same.
1861 census Address: Eel Street, Oldbury MOORE, William Head Married M 36 1825 Labourer Oldbury, Worcestershire MOORE, Mary Wife Married F 25 1836 Oldbury, Warwickshire MOORE, Mary Ann Daughter Unmarried F 2 1859 Oldbury, Worcestershire MOORE, Richard Son M 0 (7M) 1861 Oldbury, Worcestershire
This one has the father as a labourer,
There are others in West Bromwich.
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Susan
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3 Jun 2012 12:17 |
Can you tell us how you got back to Isacc bn 1862,is he related to you.
Sue
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LadyKira
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3 Jun 2012 12:18 |
1871 Address: Stone Street, Oldbury ADAMS, Elizabeth Head F 60 1811 Worcestershire ADAMS, James Son M 17 1854 Worcestershire HARPER, Thomas Grandson M 17 1854 Worcestershire PRESTON, Isaac Boarder M 49 1822 Worcestershire MOORE, William Boarder M 39 1832 Warwickshire MOORE, Jane Boarder F 35 1836 London MOORE, Samuel Son M 15 1856 Worcestershire MOORE, George Son M 12 1859 Worcestershire MOORE, Isaac Son M 4 1867 Worcestershire
father is a labourer on image.
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Susan
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3 Jun 2012 12:28 |
Good work LK
It fits perfect with the 1881 census too,maybe he put his age up on his Marriage cert he would not be the first..
There does seem to be a discrepancy with his year of birth.
Sue
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Susan
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3 Jun 2012 12:34 |
I wonder if this is his Death Reg ,it also has his birth year approx
England & Wales, Death Index: 1916-2006 about Isaac Moore Name: Isaac Moore Birth Date: abt 1862 Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1942 Age at Death: 80 Registration district: West Bromwich Inferred County: Staffordshire Volume: 6b Page: 1272
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jerseylily
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3 Jun 2012 13:00 |
I've traced back to Isaac from his great grandson who is still alive so I'm confident that far back.
On his 1882 marriage certificate Isaac gives his age as 20 so we're back to an 1862 +/-1 birth. If he were the Isaac born 1867, who I agree fits in every other respect, he would only have been about 15 when he married.
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Susan
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3 Jun 2012 13:42 |
I know to us it sounds stupid but it is not impossible back then,there are so many similarities in the census . I have known a census to be up to 5 years out on it dates when you average an age out every year for a few years in his case it could be very probable.
Sue.
Off to bed ,getting late here in OZ,will have another look around again tomorrow.
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LadyKira
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3 Jun 2012 14:04 |
Ok I have done a little work on this and I have found am anomaly but I am having a little difficulty getting my head round it. I will post in stages so it is easier to see.
First of all this is your Isaac and children and birthplaces are correct.
1911 Address: 9 Albert Street West Bromwich MOORE, Isaac Head Married M 49 1862 Iron Worker Puddler West Bromwich MOORE, Charlotte Wife Married29 years F 48 1863 West Bromwich Staffordshire MOORE, Isaac Son Single M 23 1888 Steam Gauge Worker West Bromwich MOORE, Samuel Son Single M 21 1890 Steam Gauge Worker West Bromwich MOORE, Florance Ellen Daughter Single F 18 1893 Screwer Nut And Bolt Works West Bromwich MOORE, Arthur Son Single M 16 1895 Spring Maker West Bromwich MOORE, Sarah Jane Daughter F 12 1899 School West Bromwich MOORE, Ethel Daughter F 9 1902 School West Bromwich MOORE, George Henry Son M 6 1905 School West Bromwich
1901 Address: 4, Spon Lane Railway Terrace, West Bromwich MOORE, Isaac Head Married M 39 1862 Laborer At Iron Foundry West Bromwich, Staffordshire MOORE, Charlotte Wife Married F 38 1863 West Bromwich, Staffordshire MOORE, John W Son Single M 18 1883 Turner At Axle Works West Bromwich, Staffordshire MOORE, Ann E Daughter Single F 17 1884 General Servant Domestic West Bromwich, Staffordshire MOORE, Isaac Son Single M 13 1888 West Bromwich, Staffordshire MOORE, Samuel Son Single M 11 1890 West Bromwich, Staffordshire MOORE, Florence E Daughter Single F 8 1893 West Bromwich, Staffordshire MOORE, Arthur Son Single M 6 1895 West Bromwich, Staffordshire MOORE, Sarah J Daughter Single F 2 1899 West Bromwich, Staffordshire
1891 Address: 18, Littleton Street, West Bromwich BLIZZARD, William Head Widower M 65 1826 Retired Coal Dealer Hampton-In-Arden, Warwickshire MOORE, Isaac Son In Law Married M 29 1862 Iron Worker Puddler West Bromwich, Staffordshire MOORE, Charlotte Daughter Married F 28 1863 West Bromwich, Staffordshire MOORE, John W Grandson M 8 1883 Scholar West Bromwich, Staffordshire MOORE, Ann E Granddaughter F 7 1884 Scholar West Bromwich, Staffordshire MOORE, Isaac Grandson M 3 1888 West Bromwich, Staffordshire MOORE, Samuel Grandson M 1 1890 West Bromwich, Staffordshire
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LadyKira
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3 Jun 2012 14:09 |
We then have this one with Hannah
1881 Address: 19, Stone St, Oldbury (Worcs) MOORE, William Head Married M 48 1833 Coal Miner Coventry, Warwickshire MOORE, Jane Wife Married F 45 1836 London, London, Middlesex MOORE, Saml Son Single M 25 1856 Stone Miner (Iron) Oldbury MOORE, George Son Single M 21 1860 Ironworker Oldbury MOORE, Isaac Son Single M 15 1866 Ironworker Oldbury MOORE, Hannah Daughter Single F 6 1875 Scholar Oldbury MOORE, William Son Single M 4 1877 Scholar Oldbury CARTWRIGHT, Hannah Mother Widow F 68 1813 Annuitant Nottingham GORER, Mathew Boarder Single M 50 1831 Iron Works Labourer Somerset
1871 census Address: Birmingham Street, Oldbury CARTWRIGHT, Hannah Head F 60 1811 Nottinghamshire MOORE, William Son M 39 1832 Worcestershire MOORE, John Son M 34 1837 Worcestershire CARTWRIGHT, Ephraim Son M 18 1853 Worcestershire
1861 census Address: Birmingham Street, Oldbury CARTWRIGHT, Job Head Married M 59 1802 Labourer Oldbury, Worcestershire CARTWRIGHT, Hannah Wife Married F 47 1814 Northamptonshire CARTWRIGHT, Mary Ann Daughter Unmarried F 19 1842 Iron Work Oldbury, Worcestershire CARTWRIGHT, Ephraim Son M 8 1853 Oldbury, Worcestershire GRANGER, John Lodger Unmarried M 25 1836 Carter Southwick, Staffordshire
1851 Address: Canal Street CARTWRIGHT, Job Head Married M 49 1802 Coal Miner Oldbury, Worcestershire CARTWRIGHT, Hannah Wife Married F 38 1813 Greasley, Nottinghamshire MOORE, William Son-In-Law Unmarried M 18 1833 Coal Miner Coventry, Warwickshire (probably means stepson) MOORE, John Son-In-Law Unmarried M 13 1838 Coal Miner Heavnor, Derbyshire CARTWRIGHT, Edward Son Unmarried M 10 1841 Coal Miner Oldbury, Worcestershire CARTWRIGHT, Mary Daughter F 7 1844 Scholar Oldbury, Worcestershire CARTWRIGHT, Sarah Daughter F 0 (2 MOS) 1851 Oldbury, Worcestershire CARTWRIGHT, Jane Daughter F 0 (2 MOS) 1851 Droitwhich, Worcestershire
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LadyKira
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3 Jun 2012 14:15 |
So this appears to rule out the Stone street connection
1871 Address: Stone Street, Oldbury ADAMS, Elizabeth Head F 60 1811 Worcestershire ADAMS, James Son M 17 1854 Worcestershire HARPER, Thomas Grandson M 17 1854 Worcestershire PRESTON, Isaac Boarder M 49 1822 Worcestershire MOORE, William Boarder M 39 1832 Warwickshire <<<<<< MOORE, Jane Boarder F 35 1836 London MOORE, Samuel Son M 15 1856 Worcestershire MOORE, George Son M 12 1859 Worcestershire MOORE, Isaac Son M 4 1867 Worcestershire
1871 census Address: Birmingham Street, Oldbury CARTWRIGHT, Hannah Head F 60 1811 Nottinghamshire MOORE, William Son M 39 1832 Worcestershire <<<<<<< MOORE, John Son M 34 1837 Worcestershire CARTWRIGHT, Ephraim Son M 18 1853 Worcestershire
BUT Hannah is here in Stone Street.
1881 Address: 19, Stone St, Oldbury (Worcs) MOORE, William Head Married M 48 1833 Coal Miner Coventry, Warwickshire MOORE, Jane Wife Married F 45 1836 London, London, Middlesex MOORE, Saml Son Single M 25 1856 Stone Miner (Iron) Oldbury MOORE, George Son Single M 21 1860 Ironworker Oldbury MOORE, Isaac Son Single M 15 1866 Ironworker Oldbury MOORE, Hannah Daughter Single F 6 1875 Scholar Oldbury MOORE, William Son Single M 4 1877 Scholar Oldbury CARTWRIGHT, Hannah Mother Widow F 68 1813 Annuitant Nottingham :-S :-S
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jerseylily
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3 Jun 2012 18:36 |
Thanks for your help Susan - sleep well
LK - Thank you for your hard work on my behalf
I've spent half the afternoon going round in circles with the census information that you posted. All the Isaac and Charlotte entries that you posted are correct, but he does consistently say 1862, West Bromwich. Oldbury does come under the West Brom registration district and if he was not giving the information in the earlier censuses it's likely that his parents could give Oldbury as his place of birth.
The William Moore anomaly I can make no sense of, we seem to have a William Moore, born 1832 in Coventry but living in Oldbury. He appears with his mother Hannah Cartwright in 1851 and 1881, in between he is with his London born wife Jane in Oldbury.
However a William Moore born 1832 but in Oldbury appears as a son of Hannah Cartwright in 1871 when Coventry William is with his wife and children at another address. I think I need a drink!
Job Cartwright married a Hannah Moon in 1840 in Dudley, Moon is not a million miles away from Moor so that all ties in - sort of.
I went back and had another look at the census entry which has Isaac with parents Ed and Sarah, his birth details are a much closer match and not being able to find an Edward Moore/Sarah marriage in the area wondered if he could have been William Edward or vice versa
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