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Although- my father was a factory worker, but I put engineer on my marriage cert :-D

Ooh Gritty - well done, and thanks for the 1871 census.

This all looks to be so right, BUT not once is Father William a Master Builder!

The family returned to Ireland- and William, the father, is now listed as Joseph- he was listed as William J on 1891, so most likely William Joseph? Son Joseph is not with them, which fits with him entering the Royal Artillery:

1901: Residents of a house 10 in McNamara Place (Dock Limerick Urban No. 4, Limerick)

Monk Joseph 53 Male Head Roman Cathloic City of London General Labourer
Monk Mary 39 Female Wife Roman Catholice Cork
Monk William 21 Male Son Roman Catholice Windsor, Liverpool Grocers Assistant
Monk George 17 Male Son Roman Catholice St Lukes London General Labourer
Monk Mary 13 Female Daughter Roman Catholice St Michels Limerick Scholar
Gornan Michael 57 Male Boarder Roman Catholice County Limerick Farm Labourer
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1911: Residents of a house 41 in Henry Street South (Limerick No. 5 Urban, Limerick)

Monk Joseph 64 Male Head of Family Roman Catholic England City of London Labourer General -
Monk Mary 49 Female Wife Roman Catholic City of Cork -
Monk George 27 Male Son Roman Catholic City London England Labourer General

Married 32 Years. 6 children born, 4 still living
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Possible death for father:

Name: Joseph Monk
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1850
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1913
Death Age: 63
Registration district: Limerick
Volume: 5
Page: 261
FHL Film Number: 0101605

1871 pasted for Christina:

Name: William Monk (Widower)
Age: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1846
Relation: Driver D Ra
Gender: Male
Where born: Cripplegate, Middlesex, England
Civil Parish: St Andrew
County/Island: Northumberland
Country: England
Registration district: Newcastle Upon Tyne
Sub-registration district: St Andrew
ED, institution, or vessel: Barracks
Household schedule number: 1
Piece: 5089
Folio: 79
Page Number: 8

Just in case it's relevent- the 1881 of William Monk living at 11 New Street:

1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
11, New Street, St Luke, Holborn, London, England

William Monk Head Married Male 31 1850 Labourer Cripplegate, Middlesex,
Mary Monk Wife Married Female 22 1859 - Ireland
William Monk Son Single Male 1 1880 - Windsor, Berkshire, England
John Monk Son Single Male 0 1881 - Islington, Middlesex, England
----------------------------------------------------------------------

1891:
1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Britannia Row, Islington, London, England
William J Monch Head Married Male 42 1849 Painter Labourer Cripplegate, Middlesex,
Mary Monch Wife Married Female 30 1861 - Ireland C. Cork
William Monch Son - Male 11 1880 - Liverpool, Lancashire,
Joseph Monch Son - Male 8 1883 - London, St Lukes
George T Monch Son - Male 7 1884 London, St Lukes
Mary Monch Daughter - Female 3 1888 - Ireland, Limerick
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Joseph's brother (birth place matching Josephs):
First name(s) GEORGE THOMAS
Last name MONK
Birth year 1883
Birth quarter 4
District HOLBORN
County London
Volume 1B
Page 803
Record set England & Wales births 1837-2006

The marriage that Gritty has found, could fit with the William Monk in 1871 who is in the Royal Artillery (a widower). Some of the Royal Artillery were stationed in Limerick in 1878.

If I could work out how to cut and paste on this IPad, I would do so. :-(

Possible marriage?

First name(s) William
Last name Monk
Registration year 1878
Registered Quarter/Year Jul - Sep 1878
Registration district Limerick
Volume 5
Page 225
MarriageFinder™ William Monk married one of these people
Mary Murray, Elizabeth Owens, Elizabeth M'Kinley
Record set Irish Marriages 1845-1958
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
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Address on Joseph's marriage was where his wife's family were living:

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
103 Englefield Road Essex Road Islington N, Islington, London, England
Maria Stallard Head Widow Female 44 1867 Kingsland Rd Ldn Dressmaker
Phylis G W Stallard Daughter Single Female 17 1894 Ecclesborne Rd Ldn Help At Home
Edmund C Stallard Son - Male 13 1898 Church Rd London Invalid
Janet Wise Mother Widow Female 76 1835 London -
Elizabeth Wide Sister Single Female 48 1863 Longaca London Dressmaker

It seems likely that both parents had died by the 1901 census

This looks like Joseph:

1901 census
Royal Artillery - Clarence Barracks (army)
Joseph Monk 18 - gunner - London Middlesex


This is from his attestation papers - dated 1898
Joseph Monk b.1883 St.Lukes, London

It's New Street which was a turning off the City Road. Not very far from St.Thomas Place. So it could very well be the right family.

Does't say Master Builder though. Maybe William was a Master Builder but he couldn't find a better job than labourer at the time.

It says they were living at 5 St Thomas Place. The 1891 does say Britannia St, but somehow I got 11 City Rd, Islington. Not got 1901 census

Does it say which street he was born in?

The only William Monk living in the Holborn area in 1881 is living at 11, New Street.

By 1891 they are living in Britannia Street, Islington. With the addition of an 8 year old son, Joseph

BUT William is a labourer

Joseph's father on the certificate was William and his mother Mary Murray. I can't find any record of their marriage but that may have taken place in Ireland. It does state that William was a master builder but all I can find is him as a labourer. There is a family in Essex but this would put Joseph being born Essex and on his birth cert it was Holborn.

In 1911 Phyllis was living at 103 Englefield Rd (the address on their marriage cert) with the Stallard family and her maternal aunt and grandmother both with the surname Wise.

So, neither of the witnesses are related to Joseph (the Sidney mentioned above by Barbara was not a witness but the Registrar.

Dea x

If you are sure he was born Holborn then the birth record has been posted above

Hi Shirley, thanks for that info' don't seem to be able to find this so will keep looking. Was there any others registered at the address?

???
Occ ??? Builder
1891 census
Name: William Monk
Age: 48
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1843
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Elizabeth Monk
Gender: Male
Where born: St Pancras, London, England
Civil Parish: St Pancras
Ecclesiastical parish: St James
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status:

View image
Registration district: Pancras
Sub registration district: Somers Town
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 127
Folio: 100
Page Number: 35
Household Members:
Name Age
William Monk 48
Elizabeth Monk 48

No children with them though

Maybe not here he is on the 1901
Name: William Monk
Age: 58
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1843
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Male
Birth Place: Euston, London, England
Civil Parish: Islington
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address:14 Almeida street

Occupation: organ builder

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status:

View image
Registration district: Islington
Sub-registration district: Islington, South-East
ED, institution, or vessel: 61
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 193
Folio: 155
Page Number: 5
Household schedule number: 35
Household Members:
Name Age
William Monk 58

Hi I'm not sure if Amelia is the one as I think they carried on living round Islington. So wish we could have asked my grandpa but now there are no children left who can fill us in.

Electoral roll

Name: Phyllis Monk
Year: 1929
County or Borough: Islington
Ward or Division/Constituency: Islington
she is Phyllis grace Winifred
Living at 17 Waterlow road with Joseph

Hi the date was 15/02/1925. Marriage to Phyllis Grace Winifred Stallard. He was living at 103 Engleford Rd. Islington.
Witnesses
Maria Louisa Stallard
R. Wise
Sidney [can't read the rest]

On his marriage - Joseph was a correspondence sorter for the Inland Revenue - it was his father William who was a Master Builder and was deceased at the time.

Address for both bride and groom was 103 Englefield Rd., Islington.

Witnesses Maria Louisa Stallard and R ? J Wise.

Dea x