Find Ancestors

Just a friendly tip Micheline to help you -

You know what info you have, but we don't, so we try to establish if we have the right family by posting findings and asking if we have it right, before going off along the wrong path, which is so easy to do. Hence the "is it Emily not Emma" , "is this your family" etc as you had mistakenly given the wrong name and place of birth.

Hi there everybody! Wow! You have certainly gone to a lot of trouble for me in investigating Emily Selina Williams and her husband Frederick Thomas Williams. I apologise for misquoting her name in the beginning. She is definitely Emily and not Emma!! I did already have all the information on the Bickell family thank you as they were my maternal grandmother's family. I will now study all the information you have given me on her possible death date. Thank you stars! I will come back to you if I get confused!!!

Micheline x

pm would be fine - Just come back from shopping so will do it when I have had my cup of coffee to warm me up ;-)

Dea x

P.S. All my instructions on this sort of thing have to be clear and precise (idiot proof in my case as I am not very technical either ;-) )

Dea x

Hi Dea - I'm one of those technically challenged people ! Haven't even tried to work out how to upload documents etc. to keepsafe, so some clear and concise instructions would be good. Thanks - by PM maybe, then I can keep in my message in box for future use. If you would prefer to do by email, let me know and I'll send you my addy.

Keepsafe is very useful Greyghost, especially for long articles which take AGES to type out, or if it contains a photo which can then be viewed. ;-)

Do you mean you 'don't know where to start' in order to view them or to download them to keepsafe in the first place?

If you would like to know how to work it, I could mail you some instructions if you like? (It is one of the very few things I have actually mastered :-D) - Just let me know.

Dea x

The article in Dea's keepsafe is from the 24th April. The one from the 27th is entitled Kibworth funeral. Short version, wouldn't know where to start with keepsafe.

Took place Kibworth. Moderator, the Rev. Drew and Rev. Gari Phillips officiated at service in the Congregational Church, and at graveside.
Principal mourners included Rev FT Williams (husband), Mr and Mrs Tite (daughter and son-in-law) and representatives from the Congregational Churches of Wellingborough, Kibworth, Langton and Burton Overy

Harold was the son who died in China:


Market Harborough Advertiser and Midland Mail 21 June 1935

REV. HAROLD B. WILLIAMS M.A.
The Rev. Harold B Williams, M.A.
only son of the Rev. F. T. Williams,
minister of the Wellingborough Victoria
Congregational Church has beenappointed
by the London Missionary Society as a
missionary to Central China.


Dea x

P.S. - He apparently died of pneumonia.

Dea x

A possibility for another child? Emily would have been aged c41, so not impossible.
(Not on the GRO site)

Surname First name(s) Mother District Vol Page
Births Dec 1913 (>99%)
Williams Leslie W Bickell Tynemouth 10b 504

The only other Williams/ Bickell marriage I can see apart from Frederick and Emily, between 1880 and 1920 is
1899 - Cirencester

EDIT - no, probably discount as there are other births showing on the gro site also Tynemouth prior to 1911 at least

This is daughter Edith on 1939:

Tite Household (3 People) 93 Midland Road , Wellingborough U.D., Northamptonshire, England
Start free family tree
View original image
Print
First name(s) Last name(s) DOB Occupation
Edith M Tite 25 Jan 1898 Unpaid Domestic Duties
William Tite 16 Nov 1900 Insurance Agent
Sorry, this record is officially closed. Check if you can open a closed record.

Dea x

The closest - death to year born - possibilities for a Frederick T Williams, up to 1981, but age given would be to the best of knowledge of the person registering the death. There is no suitable Leicestershire death, he could have gone anywhere.

Deaths Mar 1947 (>99%)
Williams Frederick T 74 Bethnal G. 5c 240

Deaths Sep 1960 (>99%)
WILLIAMS Frederick T 87 Garstang

And he may only have been registered as Frederick

This article from the Leicester Mercury confirms that the 1939 death is the one we are looking for:

https://www.genesreunited.co.uk/keepsafe/asset/details/59815161

Dea x

There is a probate record (granted Bristol 3 October) for an Emily Williams - died 29 July 1945 - of Alveston, Glos. w/o Henry James Williams, which might be the Emily from the Ancestry tree.

No probate record for 1939/40/41.

There would only be one if there was an estate that went to probate. Many didn't.

A tree on Ancestry suggests that this is Emily's death:

Name Emily Williams
Death Age 73
Birth Date abt 1872
Registration Date Sep 1945
Registration district Thornbury
Inferred County Gloucestershire
Volume 6a
Page 356

BUT the above 1939 suggests that she was deceased before then!

Given his address on 1939 then the Leicestershire death above in 1939 would seem favourite.


Dea x

1939 - This looks to be Frederick, going by the occupation, so Emily has died before the register was compiled - KathleenBells death is a possibility by area.

Williams Household (1 Person)
81 The Manse Leicester Road , Market Harborough R.D., Leicestershire, England
Attach to tree View original imagePrint
FIRST NAME(S) LAST NAME(S) DOB SEX OCCUPATION MARITAL STATUS SCHEDULE SCHEDULE SUB NUMBER
Frederick T Williams 07 Nov 1871 Male Congregational Minister Widowed 76 1

A change of occupation for Frederick - and another child

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
9 Mount Pleasant Bilston, Bilston, Staffordshire, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Occupation Age Birth year Birth place
Frederick Williams Head Married Male Congregation Minister 38 1873 Gloucestershire Bristol
Emily Williams Wife Married Female - 38 1873 Gloucestershire Bristol
Edith Williams Daughter - Female School 13 1898 Gloucestershire Bristol
Harold Williams Son - Male - 4 1907 Gloucestershire Bristol

Married 15 years, 2 children born to marriage

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
9 Mount Pleasant Bilston, Bilston, Staffordshire, England

Learn more
Print transcription View image
Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Occupation Age Birth year Birth place
Frederick Williams Head Married Male Congregation Minister 38 1873 Gloucestershire Bristol
Transcription
Emily Williams Wife Married Female - 38 1873 Gloucestershire Bristol
Transcription
Edith Williams Daughter - Female School 13 1898 Gloucestershire Bristol
Transcription
Harold Williams Son - Male - 4 1907 Gloucestershire Bristol
Transcription
Census details


Dea x

Possible death but in a different area:-

England & Wales deaths 1837-2007 Transcription
Print transcription View image
First name(s) EMILY S
Last name WILLIAMS
Gender Female
Birth day -
Birth month -
Birth year 1872
Age 67
Death quarter 2
Death year 1939
District Leicester
County Leicestershire
Volume 7A
Page 287
Country England
Record set England & Wales Deaths 1837-2007

Kath. x

When is the last time that you know that she/Frederick were still alive?

1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
13, Chancery Street, Bristol, Gloucestershire, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Frederick T Williams Head Married Male 28 1873 Iron Moulder Bristol, Gloucestershire, England
Emily Williams Wife Married Female 29 1872 - Bristol, Gloucestershire, England
Edith Williams Daughter - Female 3 1898 - Bristol, Gloucestershire, England

Is this your family - Emily said to be born Gloucestershire, not Somerset.

She's in the Barton Regis RD (Glos.) on census, same RD the marriage was registered

1881 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
31, Church Street, Ss Philip and Jacob (Out), Barton Regis, Gloucestershire, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Charles H Bickell Head Married Male 32 1849 Gas Stoker Birmingham, Warwickshire, England
Emma L Bickell Wife Married Female 32 1849 Gas Stokers Wife Bristol, Gloucestershire, England
Charles H Bickell Son Single Male 11 1870 Scholar Bristol, Gloucestershire, England
Emily S Bickell Daughter Single Female 9 1872 Scholar Bristol, Gloucestershire, England
Edward G Bickell Son Single Male 5 1876 Scholar Bristol, Gloucestershire, England
Lilly L Bickell Daughter Single Female 3 1878 - Bristol, Gloucestershire, England
Ada M Bickell Daughter Single Female 1 1880 - Bristol, Gloucestershire, England

---------------------------
1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Tenby Street, St Philip & St Jacob Out, Barton Regis, Gloucestershire, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Charles H Bickell Head Married Male 43 1848 Gas Stoker Warwickshire, England
Emma L Bickell Wife Married Female 43 1848 - Gloucestershire, England
Albert W Bickell Son Single Male 23 1868 Elementary School Master Bristol, Gloucestershire, England
Charles H Bickell Son Single Male 21 1870 Clerk Wholesale Grocers Gloucestershire, England
Emily S Bickell Daughter Single Female 19 1872 - Gloucestershire, England
Edward G Bickell Son Single Male 15 1876 Pupil Teacher Gloucestershire, England
Tilly L Bickell Daughter - Female 13 1878 Scholar Gloucestershire, England
Ada M Bickell Daughter - Female 11 1880 Scholar Bristol, Gloucestershire, England
Barnett Bickell Son - Male 9 1882 Scholar Gloucestershire, England
Alfred J Bickell Son - Male 6 1885 Scholar Bristol, Gloucestershire, England
Walter T Bickell Son - Male 4 1887 - Gloucestershire, England
Ernest V Bickell Son - Male 2 1889 - Gloucestershire, England