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Sorry Liz gave wrong marriage date - Thomas married 04 Jun 1880..

Liz, Once again thanks. Thanks also for the info on the murphy family - yes Thomas married Mary (nee Kean) 07 Sep 1858 in Edin. parish and his occupation was a frame maker so that all fits! As for Patrick and Bridget, I do know that Bridget did remarry and became a Gearty. Kind regards Rob

Robin, There are six children listed in 1881 census, the same as those named in IGI. I think Jane and Janet are one and the same person, as one is a birth date and the other a christening date. As neither Jane/Janet or Robert are on census, i presume they must have died prior to 1881. Liz

Hi Liz, Thank you so very much for the information. Having compared the list of Symes you provided from Family Search and compared it to the 1881 Census info, I can only verify 6 of the 9 children - am I reading that correctly?? Don't want to assume other family members. Regards Rob

Taken from family search Father: Robert Syme, Mother: Margaret Fraser 1. MATTHEW SYM - Birth: 03 MAY 1860 Edinburgh Parish, Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland 2. JOHN SYME - Birth: 18 MAR 1865 Edinburgh Parish, Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland 3. MARGARET FRASER SYME - Birth: 20 FEB 1867 Edinburgh Parish, Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland 4. EUPHEMIA SYME - Birth: 24 OCT 1857 Edinburgh Parish, Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland 5. THOMAS SYME - Birth: 16 AUG 1873 Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland 6. JANET SYME -Birth: 09 JAN 1869 Edinburgh Parish, Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland 7. AGNES SCHULE SIM Birth: 08 SEP 1862 Edinburgh Parish, Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland 8. ROBERT SYME - Birth: 11 OCT 1870 Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland 9. JANE A. SYME - Christening: 14 FEB 1869 Lothian Road Associate Congregation, Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland 1881 census details Dwelling: Fountain House Census Place: Edinburgh St Cuthberts, Edinburgh, Scotland Source: FHL Film 0223992 GRO Ref Volume 685-1 EnumDist 67 Page 2 Marr Age Sex Birthplace Robert SYME M 47 M Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland Rel: Head Occ: Rubber Worker Margaret SYME M 49 F Fifeshire, Kirkcudbright, Scotland Rel: Wife Euphemia SYME U 23 F Edinburgh, Edinburgh, Scotland Rel: Dau Handicap: Imbecile Mathew SYME U 21 M Edinburgh, Edinburgh, Scotland Rel: Son Occ: Coachbuilder Agnes SYME U 18 F Edinburgh, Edinburgh, Scotland Rel: Dau Occ: Machinist John SYME U 16 M Edinburgh, Edinburgh, Scotland Rel: Son Occ: Message Boy Margaret SYME U 14 F Edinburgh, Edinburgh, Scotland Rel: Dau Occ: Scholar Thomas SYME U 7 M Edinburgh, Edinburgh, Scotland Was Thomas Murphy married by 1881, could this be him in census. Dwelling: 30 High Riggs Building Inglis Entry Census Place: Edinburgh St Cuthberts, Edinburgh, Scotland Source: FHL Film 0223989 GRO Ref Volume 685-1 EnumDist 10 Page 10 Marr Age Sex Birthplace Thomas MURPHY M 22 M Edinburgh, Edinburgh, Scotland Rel: Head Occ: Frame Maker Mary MURPHY M 18 F Edinburgh, Edinburgh, Scotland Rel: Wife Michael MURPHY U 15 M Edinburgh, Edinburgh, Scotland Rel: Brother Occ: Message Boy Can't find a Bridget that fits. There's only one Patrick and Bridget together in 1881, but looks like she's his second wife, so not them. Liz I just found this on familysearch, it's not an extracted entry but a submitted one. Margaret's birthplace is more likely to be Kirkcaldy, as in census she gives her birthplace in Fifeshire, was puzzled by Kirkcudbright, as this is in Kirkcudbrightshire. Margaret Frazer Female Event(s): Birth: 01 OCT 1831 Kirkcaldy, Fife, Scotland Parents: Father: John Frazer Family Mother: Euphemia Miller

Rob, It's www.FamilySearch.org --- It's the latter day sain'ts website. Betty Good night hope you find Euphenica and daughter Margaret.

Betty, It has to be. As I said earlier I had be given detail of a Robert and Margaret by my dad but we thought it may have been an uncle to Thomas not his father, but we have got our dates wrong I guess. It all seems to add up. Tried searching for that family search site but with difficulty - have you the link please ....I know I am a cretin!! R

Rob is this them THOMAS SYME Male -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Event(s): Birth: 16 AUG 1873 Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland Christening: Death: Burial: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Parents: Father: ROBERT SYME Family Mother: MARGARET FRASER

Hi Rob, Sorry cant find birth of Margaret Fraser, in fact can't find marriage of Eupenica to John either SORRY. Betty

Hi Betty, You can tell I am a novice to this game eh?? Thanks I will use the family site search first and then revert to the other even if it costs. Still trying to confirm that Thomas Syme's parents were Robert and Margaret Fraser daughter of John and Euphenica Miller..but it is getting really late. Very grateful for all you have provided - interesting call to my folks tomorrow now! Kind Regards Rob

Hi Rob, Just thought i would tell you I found these on the FREE FamilySearch.org website. If you searched ScotlandsPeople you would have to pay £6 for 30 credits to find these details, however it is a good website for census and BMD if you can't find them on the familySearch website first. Betty p.s. who am i looking for now I have forgot.???

Hi Betty, It has to be - amazing!!! Thank you so much Rob

Thomas's birth??? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- THOMAS MURPHY Male -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Event(s): Birth: 07 SEP 1858 Edinburgh Parish, Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland Christening: Death: Burial: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Parents: Father: PATRICK MURPHY Family Mother: BRIDGET GORMAN

Betty, Have an address of 4 Dunbar St Edinburgh but don;t know if this was where she was born and with parents John Fraser (Mason) and Eupenica Miller. Rob

Hi Rob, Where was Margaret Fraser born?? Betty

Hi Rob, You see Murphy is also an Irish name and many Irish people came to Scotland during the potato famine, many to Edinburgh, in fact too many for a search of just name and approx year of birth. There could be hundreds within a few years of one another. Also census birth years can always be a year or two out on any census. Betty

Hi Betty, As for Thomas Murphy, I have his parents as Patrick Murphy (very helpful!) and Bridgette Gorman born around the 1828/30 I guess. To make things worse they may have moved from Ireland just prior to Thomas' birth - sorry. Very spookey that Fountainbridge appears for both families. Rob

Hi Betty, Goodness, very well could be. My dad gave me details last weekend of a Robert Syme (of 85 Fountain Bridge) and Margaret Fraser (born 01/10/1831) but with no clear link. We suspected maybe an uncle to Thomas but unsure. Possible his parents instead??? Rob

Hi Rob, Also lods on Thomas Murphy's born in Edinburgh 1859 and 1860's, if you had the parents it would help. Betty

Hi again Rob, Ther are a lot of Thomas Syme names born about this time in Edinburgh, any clue about parents at all??? betty