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Now know that Ada Rutter died in 1927.
So MY Walter Mann did not marry her!

Ernest was born 1900 and Elsie was born 1911 - dont yet know of any other children

I know that Walter married Annie kilby nee Fowkes in the quarter after Adas death, so I guess Robert (Kilby) born in 1917 may well have been Walters child in addition to Irene born in 1922.
Gill

HI Steph

I find it so facinating and need to find out if Eliza WAS Walters wife & for how long. and if she was - did they have any children?

Need also to check out Adas date of death & confirm it.-
I can only find Ada & Walter having 1 child - Ernest in 1900 - but wonder if they had any others?

Also, Annie Kilby nee Fowkes had a child, Robert Kilby in 1917, but her husband had died in 1914, so who was Roberts dad?

Also, WHY the delay in Walter marrying Annie (1927) when they had had a child together in 1922?

I will do my best to discover some answers - if you want and are able to, I hope you can help me too. Looking forward to solving the puzzle.
Gill

Hi Gillian,

have sent you a pm.

Steph

Hi Steph
You gave me this:
Marriages Dec 1912 (97%)
Draper Eliza A Mann Leicester 7a 655
MANN Walter J Draper Leicester 7a 655
Could this be Walter Manns first marriage?

But I believe that Walter married Ada Rutter in 1899 an dont think she died until 1919(?)
Can this be checked? If I am wrong and she died before 1912, or if they got divorced, then Eliza could have been Walters 2nd marriage
( before he married my gran, Annie Kilby nee Fowkes in 1927). _ I would like to check these possibiities if possible, as it would make sense of the big puzzle that I have; WHY didnt Walter marrie Annie until 1927 - Annies husband had passed in 1914 and Walter & Annie had had a child together in 1922 - WHY delay getting married ( unless, perhaps, one of them was already married????

Walter Mann, (who by the way wasnt a draper) married Ada Rutter in 1899 and had a son Ernest Mann in 1900. I believe that Ada died in 1919. So dont think Eliza was his wife.
Walter then had a child Irene in 1922 with my grandmother Annie Kilby(nee Fowkes). Irene was registered as a Kilby, but Walter Mann married my gran in 1927 and in 1934 Irenes birth name was re-registered as a Mann.
I had wondered if the reason Annie, (whos first husband died in 1914) and Walter hadnt got married for the birth of their daughter Irene, was that one of them was married(?) again. i.e between 1914-1927 in the case of Annie Kilby she may have married again? or in the cas of Walter Mann, between the years 1919-1927 he had married again?
Just a thought. Also, was Ernest an only child?

Surname First name(s) Spouse District Vol
Page

Marriages Dec 1912 (97%)

Draper Eliza A Mann Leicester 7a 655
MANN Walter J Draper Leicester 7a 655

Could this be Walter Manns first marriage?

Gillian,

Your grandma marrying Walter Mann happened in 1927.

She married Herbert Kilby in 1909.

I have amended my post to show this.

Thanks Steph - you have the right Annie.
She was my grandma, married Herbert and I believ that he died in 1914 not sure why, need to get his death cert.
I believe that she had three more children,
Herbert Kilby jnr 1910
Robert Kilby in 1917
Irene Kilby/Mann in 1922 - (registered as Kilby then re-registered as Mann in 1934)
But she didnt marry Walter Mann until 1922, even though I believe that his wife Ada Rutter, died in 1919. any ideas if Herbert Kilby had been married between his 1st wife dying 1919 and him marrying my grandma in 1927?

Christine - sorry none of those nams - nor Birmingham feature in my family trree at the moment - dont think there is any connection. sorry.
good luck
Gill

I found the following marriages for Annie Fowkes. firstly to Herbert Kilby and then to Walter Mann.

Presume this is the correct Annie?


Surname First name(s) District Vol Page

Marriages Dec 1909 (>99%)
FOWKES Annie Leicester 7a 587
KILBY Herbert Frank Leicester 7a 587


Surname First name(s) Spouse District Vol Page

Marriages Jun 1927 (48%)
Kilby Annie Mann Leicester 7a 742
Mann Walter J Kilby Leicester 7a 742


Surname First name(s) Mother District Vol Page

Births Dec 1911 (>99%)

Kilby Leonard Fowkes Leicester 7a 411


Surname First name(s) Mother District Vol Page


Births Dec 1913 (95%)

Kilby George Fowkes Leicester 7a 356


These two births were on freebmd. There may be more.

hi my great great grandfather came from lecistershire to birmingham . great grandad lived in sparkhill and was a master carpenter , my dad was charles james married to mom alice maud 19 23.
i am christine chattaway nee mann born in 1930

hi my great great grandfather came from lecistershire to birmingham . great grandad lived in sparkhill and was a master carpenter , my dad was charles james married to mom alice maud 19 23.
i am christine chattaway nee mann born in 1930

Trying to find out about my grandmother - Annie Mann nee Fowkes. She lived in Leicester and died in about 1972. I believe that she was borm in 1893 (ish).Her daughter, my mother was Irene Mann and married Bernard Nash.
Does anyone have any info about the Mann or Fowkes family - Annies husbands name & other childrens names would help me greatly. thanks.