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1871 census..........

Name: Charles Norris
Age: 13
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1858
Relation: Son
Father's Name: John J
Mother's Name: Mary Ann
Gender: Male
Where born: Shoreditch, Middlesex, England

Civil Parish: St Leonard Shoreditch
Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul Haggerstone
County/Island: London
Country: England


Registration district: Shoreditch
Sub-registration district: Haggerston East
ED, institution, or vessel: 2
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 32
Household Members: Name Age
Charles Norris 13
John J Norris 44
John J Norris 18
Mary Ann Norris 41
Samuel Norris 11


AND 1861

Name: Charles Norris
Age: 3
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1858
Relation: Son
Father's Name: John
Mother's Name: Mary
Gender: Male
Where born: Shoreditch, Middlesex, England

Civil Parish: Shoreditch St Leonard
Ecclesiastical parish: Haggerston St Mary
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England


Registration district: Shoreditch
Sub-registration district: Haggerstone East
ED, institution, or vessel: 2
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 60
Household Members: Name Age
Charles Norris 3
John Norris 35
John Norris 8
Mary Norris 32
Samuel Norris 1

The son John Joshua married in 1877..........

Reg

Reg you are very kind for finding that out for me thank you kind regards Ann.

Possibly the brother?

Name: Thomas Greaves Norris
Year of Registration: 1844
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
District: Hackney
County: Greater London, London, Middlesex
Volume: 3
Page: 142

Eight names on the page.........!!

Reg

IGI.............

JOHN JOSHUA NORRIS
Male


Christening: 02 NOV 1828 St Botolph Bishopsgate, London, London, England


Parents:
Father: THOMAS NORRIS
Mother: ELIZABETH



Full Batch info............

Norris, British Isles
Father: Thomas , Mother: Elizabeth
Exact Spelling: Off
Batch Number: C001618

1. JOHN JOSHUA NORRIS - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 02 NOV 1828 St Botolph Bishopsgate, London, London, England

2. THOMAS GREEVES NORRIS - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 02 NOV 1828 St Botolph Bishopsgate, London, London, England

3. SARAH SCOTMAN NORRIS - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 02 NOV 1828 St Botolph Bishopsgate, London, London, England

Reg

Thank you for you help Reg kind regards Ann x.

1881.........John is a Labourer

Name: John Joshua Norris
Age: 52
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1829
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Mary Ann
Gender: Male
Where born: Bishopgate

Civil Parish: St Leonard
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street address: 10 Goldsmith Sqre.
Condition as to marriage: Married

Occupation: Labourer

Registration district: Shoreditch
Sub-registration district: Haggerston
ED, institution, or vessel: 21
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
George Glover 15
Charles Norris 23
John Norris 4
John Joshua Norris 52
Mary Ann Norris 51
Samuel Norris 21

Reg

John Thomas with parents Thomas and Lydia does not seem to me to be the same person as John Joshua, with parents Thomas and Elizabeth

I appreciate that Thomas could have had more than one wife....however, as there are baptism records for both Johns, one must assume they were different people.

John Thomas's baptism fits with the age recorded on the 1841 and 1851 census......John Joshua was apparently a year or more younger........

Reg

Oh Thank God i thought i had upset you Julie, i hope you are ok and as for the word Novice that and the name Julie do not go together!!!!! Ann x.

Oh Julie i hope you did not think i thought you were a novice PLEASE i never thought that Ann x

thank you yes i have ordered the m/c for john joshua norris so when that comes i will let you know thanks again so very much x i have to sigh of now but will return later!!! thank you again Ann

Julie what I meant is that the John Joshua Norris parents Thomas and Elizabeth baptised 2 Nov 1828
St Botolphs Bishopgate (IGI)

Is a different family to John Thomas Norris
Parents Thomas and Lydia
baptised 4 Sep 1825 St Stephan Coleman st,(IGI)
I'm not really sure which family Ann thinks hers is.

I suppose if genealogy was straightforward it would not be as much fun. Mine were always changing names too.

Well we all learn from each other and all make mistakes. Your puzzle keeps getting to me.

I found a Thomas and an Elizabeth without any children on the 1841 census in Hornsey parish.

I also found 3 Johns at around the right age, living in various mixed households in London. Its possible that John Joshua was living away from home.

Thank you Trinni, i must say i am a complete novice at all this to!!!!! Trinni i do feel so stupid at times but you all have been so helpful to me, but i do feel i am upsetting folk "Janet" has told me off already.
Thank you Trinni and every one you are so kind, very kind regards Ann.

Ann, with regards to your John Joshua, I thought the christening record ( on the other thread), said that he was christened John Joshua?
IGI: 2 November 1828 father Thomas Mother Elizabeth St Boltoph, Bishopgate London

The John Thomas that Julie found might be a totally different family?

I'm rather a novice here myself, so hope I'm not talking complete nonsence.
Is it possible that the John in the 1841 census with the mother Lydia, is not your John, but in fact John Thomas and that your John is elsewhere?

If your John was John Joshua in later life, I would certainly tend to go with the one that was Christened John Joshua.

Hi Ozi YES thank you! sorry never got back to you in between jobs at the moment [finding time Hey!] but again thank you Ozi kind regards Ann.

Ann, did you see the charity schools in Shoreditch reference I found on your other thread? I hope it is helpful.

Ozi.

Thanks Julie you really are helpful kind regards Ann x

Julie i see what you mean now looking on those Christening records i think i will have start at the begining again [ Oh Dear i don't think i am very good at this researching game} thank you all again kind regards Ann.

Thank you all for helping me here!
I have checked again on John Joshua Norris 1827
Yes that was his second name [Joshua] as in the 1891 census he was named as Joshua Norris age 64 and living with his Son John age 39 in Kingsland Road Shoreditch. I think he must of started to use the name Joshua instead of John as not to confuse every one in the family. [My God it's confusing me!!]
Many thanks for the help, very kind regards Ann.

Ann, I had an identical problem that I have recently solved. Different mothers name to the wife in the census. I looked on free BMD and found a death that fell within the time of the birth of the last child and the first 41 census. So I sent for the certificate and bingo, the husband was the informer and the name was right. The different name in 41 was because he had remarried.

I also have another family where the mothers name is just written wrongly by accident. 4 of the children have Anne as a mother and one has Elizabeth, and she fell in the middle. So just an error.