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Peter

My brain now is well n truley pickled! In 3 mins time it's xmas day here in the UK and i have an army to feed by 2pm.....3 kids and partners also 8 grandchildren. Ages from 21 down to 8.

I am missing an onion to make my irish home made stuffing.....a dog thats a veggie and off his food (he's old and has a heart condition) and two cats that eat me out of house n home!

Now your giving me 'Suttons' and 'Fleetwoods'and OMG a 'Krafft'!!!!!

Tis time i wasnt here...

Nighty night Peter. Happy Christmas and a happy new year to you n yours.

Gerri x

Gerri - I was holding nothing back - just did with a combination of free BMD, Ancestry, sideways thinking and luck.
Now I have William Sutton married to Elizabeth Yates, and William's sister Fleetwood (good name for searching!!!) married a John Thomas Yates (mar 1891) my gut feeling is that there is a connection between the Yates', that is the latest challenge. Another of their siblings, Alice Sutton, married my grand uncle, james Krafft, so I don't know why I'm doing this - addiction perhaps?????

Peter

Peter YateR/Yates must have died either Dec 1860 reg 1st quarter of 1861 or Jan.Feb/March of 1861......just befor census night.

So the YateR family must be yours!

Sorry went off elsewhere and came back to this lol

Gerri x

Peter Yates Death

1861 Q1
Wigan
8c-36

HOW did you work that out Peter!
Seems you were holding back on your info? lol

Well done!

Gerri

How does this look then?
Mary Perry marries Thomas Aspinall Q1 1851 and is with him on 1851 census.
Thomas dies Q1 1852 and Mary marries Peter Yates Q2 1852. He dies Q1 1861 and she remarries John Winstanley in 1868......
Need to treat myself to some certs!!

Peter

Been thinking....

Hubby YateR must of been around 9 months before young Thomas yateR was born......so!

7 April 1861 census night.

That takes us back to abt January 1860.

We need to look for a male Yates death between Dec 1859 and March 1868?...Wigan.

Gerri x

Everything fits with the "Yater"family - but it looks to me as though mary is listed as head of household and widow - which unfortunately doesn't get me where I wanted to be (unless I go the bit\rth cert route!!).

Joseph on next page can't therefoere be the father, but the street looks to be full of Yates......

Peter

I think the Yater family as above is most likely but a possible alternative, if Esther did not survive to 1871, Thomas is not yet born, and William has left home in 1871.

1861 England Census
about Ann Yates
Name: Ann Yates
Age: 9
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1852
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Moses
Mother's Name: Mary
Gender: Female
Where born: Clayton Le Dale, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish: Clayton Le Dale
Ecclesiastical parish: St Peter
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View Image

Registration district: Blackburn
Sub-registration district: Mellor
ED, institution, or vessel: 7a
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 31
Household Members: Name Age
Ann Yates 9
Elizabeth Yates 6
Esther Yates 1
Mary Yates 35
Moses Yates 37
William Yates 10

Yes- they are the ones I have. Elizabeth married(1881) William Sutton - who is living next door in 1871....

YateR - absolutely brilliant - thanks - now off to research Yates/Sutton cousin marriages

Merry Xmas

Peter in NZ

these people?

Name: John Winstanley
Age: 42
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1829
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Mary
Gender: Male
Where born: Orrell, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish: Ince in Makerfield
Ecclesiastical parish: Christchurch
Town: Ince in Makerfield
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England


Registration district: Wigan
Sub-registration district: Hindley
ED, institution, or vessel: 19
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 247
Household Members: Name Age

John Winstanley 42
Mary Winstanley 93 <<AGE 39 NOT 93
Ann Yates 17
Elizabeth Yates 15
Thomas Yates 10

1861 BET THIS IS THEM

Name: Elizabeth Yater
Age: 5
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1856
Relation: Daughter
Mother's Name: Mary
Gender: Female
Where born: Wigan, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish: Wigan
Ecclesiastical parish: St George
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View Image

Registration district: Wigan
Sub-registration district: Wigan
ED, institution, or vessel: 6
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 89
Household Members: Name Age

Henry Leigh 26
Margt Leigh 23
Anne Yater 7
Elizabeth Yater 5
James Yater 3
Mary Yater 29
Thomas Yater 6 Mo

DAD OVER THE PAGE JOSEPH AGE 28 A BRICKMAKER, BORN WIGAN

1871 John Winstanley(42) is living in Ince in Makerfield, Lancs with wife Mary (93 but record says 39) b Wigan. In same household are stepchildren Ann YATES(17), Elizabeth Yates(15) and Thomas Yates(10).
John and Mary married March Q 1868 in Wigan

I need to find the Yates who is the childrens'father but can't find any of them in 1861 - a fresh pair of eyes would be appreciated.

Peter