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Dear K and Christine, thanks so much for your input. I am sorry I didn't reply earlier, I have been tied up trying to sort out a re-mortgage today.

K, that is the right marriage in 1921 where he is a widower. I don't have the certificate here to check witnesses. All I can say here is that Robert was married previously to his marriage in 1921. We believe he had a least one son from his first marriage.

We have been told that Robert was born in Toxteth.

Maybe I am getting to hung up on the engineering father but I am sure he is the Robert with Thomas and Rebecca and not with Jane.

Also we are trying to establish a link to Frank Whittle born 1907? who was the inventor of the jet engine (engines again). Family rumour says Robert was Frank's grandfather.

Google says that Frank's parents were Moses and Sarah Whittle. I am trying to do this for an elderley lady and its difficult to get information.

I will send an email to try to establish witnesses etc from the marriage cert but I don't think I will get a reply straight way.

I really appreciate all the help,

Selena.

I realised the Blackburn 1901 one wasn't the one with unmarried mother Jane it's so difficult as there are so many Robert Whittle's and although he was in Blackburn in 1921 he could have been born anywhere.

I did find one in 1881 with father Thomas but he was born 1865, he was a tavern waiter but it's all guesswork without further information.

Christine

Hi Christine

I found that one. For Selina's benefit I attach him with mother and grandfather in 1871. Jane marries pre 1881 to Edward Green, with Robert. Robert is working as a cotton spinner in 1891 and lodging with his mother in 1901 with his wife Alice and two children whilst still working as a cotton spinner.

Will have another look at possiblities.

Selena - Do you know if any possible relatives where witnesses at his wedding in 1921

K


1871

Name: Robert Whittle
Age: 4
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1867
Relation: Son
Mother's Name: Jane
Gender: Male
Where born: Walton-Le-Dale, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish: Walton Le Dale
Ecclesiastical parish: St Leonards
Town: Walton
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View Image

Registration district: Preston
Sub-registration district: Walton le Dale
ED, institution, or vessel: 2
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 81
Household Members: Name Age
Mary Halstead 27 Boarder
Jane Whittle 36 Cotton Weaver
Robert Whittle 68 Market Gardener
Robert Whittle 4
all born in Walton le dale


Selena

Just an afterthought but is this Robert's marriage and if so do you know his middle name and wife's first name?

K

Surname First name(s) Spouse District Vol Page

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Marriages Jun 1921 (53%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Whittle Robert W Coupe Blackburn 8e 894

Hi Kay,

No I haven't found one with a father Thomas, just mother Jane unmarried but in the Blackburn area.

Christine

Christine

Have you found a Robert with a father Thomas other than the one that died? Selena found one on the post that disappeared, from near Preston but the father was not and enginner and the son Robert didn't have the right occupation.

I have also found options but nothing that ties to a father Thomas that was an engineer or a Robert who was in the right profession in 1901 - although he could have changed!

Kay

That's what i also found K.

Have found a possible for him in all the census years

Christine

Selena

The Robert in 1871 does not appear with the family in 1881 - I would think the John R in 1881 would be his older brother

Sadly there is a death of a Robert in the right Reg District below and the birth of John R whose middle name wasn't Robert

I will continue to look for the younger and older Robert, but the 1871 Record may not be him

Kx

Deaths Dec 1873 (>99%)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Whittle Robert 6 W.Derby 8b 285


Births Sep 1865 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------
Whittle John Robson W. Derby 8b 332

If this is the correct one I can trace him back but not with a father Thomas, looks as if this one's mother Jane was unmarried and later married so he is then stepson in 1881.

It could be possible that the father's name was just invented.

I don't think the Robert in West Derby is the correct one as I found this death

Deaths Dec 1873 (>99%)

Whittle Robert 6 W.Derby 8b 285

This explains why Robert isn't with the family after 1871.

Christine

Could this be him in 1891 as it is Blackburn registration district.

1891 England Census
about Robt Whittle
Name: Robt Whittle
Age: 24
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1867
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Lucy
Gender: Male
Where born: Croston, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish: Oswaldtwistle
Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul
Town: Oswaldtwistle
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street address:

Registration district: Blackburn
Sub-registration district: Oswaldtwistle
ED, institution, or vessel: 5
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Lucy Whittle 23
Robt Whittle 24


His occupation is Labourer.

Christine

Scousenana, many thanks for that, its very helpful.

I'm wondering where Robert is for 91 and 01. We think he might be running a pub or in that trade.

Have to be out this morning but will check back at lunchtime to see if anyone has had any luck with finding Robert.

Thanks so much for the help,

Selena

Possible death for Thomas
Deaths Jun 1898 (>99%)
Whittle Thomas 63 Liverpool 8b 114

1891
Name: Thomas Whittle
Age: 56
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1835
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Rebecca
Gender: Male
Where born: Durham, England
Civil Parish: Everton
Ecclesiastical parish: St Saviour
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street address:
Occupation:
Condition as to marriage:
Education:
Employment status: View Image
Registration district: West Derby
Sub-registration district: North Everton
ED, institution, or vessel: 28
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Thos H Roberts 12
Edith R Whittle 16
Jane L Whittle 9
Rebecca Whittle 55
Rebecca Whittle 18
Thomas Whittle 56
Thomas Whittle 28
Source Citation: Class: RG12; Piece: 2956; Folio 79; Page 14; GSU roll: 6098066.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
1901 No Thomas Snr.
Name: Rebecca Whittle
Age: 65
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1836
Relation: Head
Gender: Female
Where born: Prescot, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: Walton On The Hill
Ecclesiastical parish: St Margaret
Town: Liverpool
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street address:
Occupation:
Condition as to marriage:
Education:
Employment status: View Image
Registration district: West Derby
Sub-registration district: Walton
ED, institution, or vessel: 35
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 190
Household Members: Name Age
John R Budd 5
Thomas H Roberts 22
Edith R Whittle 26
Jane L Whittle 19
Rebecca Whittle 65
Source Citation: Class: RG13; Piece: 3457; Folio: 21; Page: 34.

I wondered where it had gone! I will look again tommorrow if no one has already found them


Kayx

Here is the 1881 but no Robert

Household:

Name Relation Marital Status Gender Age Birthplace Occupation Disability
Thomas WHITTLE Head M Male 46 Ouston, Durham, England Engine Fitter
Rebecca WHITTLE Wife M Female 45 Prescot, Lancashire, England
Isabella WHITTLE Daur U Female 22 St Helens, Lancashire, England
Thomas WHITTLE Son Male 18 Liverpool, Lancashire, England Railway Booking Clerk
John R. WHITTLE Son Male 15 Liverpool, Lancashire, England Clerk Stock & Share Broker
Rebecca WHITTLE Daur Female 8 Liverpool, Lancashire, England Scholar
Edith R. WHITTLE Daur Female 6 Liverpool, Lancashire, England Scholar


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Source Information:
Dwelling 78 Stanfield Rd
Census Place Everton, Lancashire, England
Family History Library Film 1341878
Public Records Office Reference RG11
Piece / Folio 3665 / 40
Page Number 8

Sorry K, I accidently pressed the delete button while trying to edit my thread.

Looking Robert Whittle and his father on 1901 census, or any census that would help.

Robert Whittle married in 1921, aged 52, widower, in Blackburn Lancashire. Robert’s profession Licensed Victualler Retired. Father Thomas, deceased, mechanical engineer.

Here is the 1871 that K kindly found for me:
1871

Name: Robert Whittle
Age: 3
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1868
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Thomas
Mother's Name: Rebecca
Gender: Male
Where born: Lank, Liverpool

Civil Parish: Everton
Ecclesiastical parish: St Saviour
Town: Liverpool
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Registration district: West Derby
Sub-registration district: Toxteth Park
ED, institution, or vessel: 61
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 139
Household Members: Name Age
Isabella Whittle 12
John R Whittle 6
Joseph H Whittle 8 months
Mary E Whittle 15
Rebecca Whittle 35 Lancashire Whiston
Robert Whittle 3
Thomas Whittle 37 Engine Fittter b Durham
Thomas Whittle 8
William H Whittle 13