Genealogy Chat

Hi.. I hope someone reading this can help. I am tracing my family tree but have came up against a brick wall around 1891 (when my great grandfather arrived in Scotland from Italy).
I thought a good way to start tracing things back from the Italian side would be to find out where he came from and start again from there... do you think ship passenger lists would be a good place to start and if so does anyone know where I could find such information?
Many thanks in advance
Sharon

What's his name and birth year.

Where is Scotland was he living.

Might be able to find him in the census...sometimes it indicates place of birth as well as country.

Hi Helen, thanks for replying... his name was Giovanni Bellonzi, I dont have an exact date of birth as his records are no doubt in Italy but death certificate tells me that it was 1873... I have tried the 1891 Census on 'Scotlands People' but not a lot of information, only that he was 18 when the census was recorded and where he lived in Clydebank, Scotland at the time.
Sharon

Sharon,

Had a look at the 1901 census and unfortunately, it doesn't show where in Italy your Giovanni originated from.

1891 Scotland Census
about Giovanni Bellonzi
Name: Giovanni Bellonzi
Age: 18
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1873
Relationship: Servt (Servant)
Gender: Male
Where born: (Naturalized), Italy
Registration Number: 501
Registration district: Old Kilpatrick
Civil Parish: Old Kilpatrick
Town: Clydebank
County: Dumbartonshire
Address: 2 Kilbowie Ro
Occupation: Ice Cream Salesman
ED: 13
Household schedule number: 150
Line: 22
Roll: CSSCT1891_162
Household Members: Name Age
Frank Cameron
31
Annie Cameron
24
George Goraham
25
Giovanni Bellonzi
18
Lizzie Bellonzi
25



1901 Scotland Census
about Agenes Vicunio
Name: Agenes Vicunio
Age: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1876
Relationship: Boarder
Where born: Foreyn Subject, Italy
Registration Number: 625/3
Registration district: Bellshill
Civil Parish: Bothwell
County: Lanarkshire
Address: Wotherspoon's Ld Main St
Occupation: Fish Shopkeeper
ED: 12
Household schedule number: 46
Line: 10
Roll: CSSCT1901_250
Household Members:
Name Age
Giovanni Belonzi 28
Guzeppi Grilla 9
Piro Belli 32
Lizzie Vicunio 50
Agenes Vicunio 25

Wonder if the library in Bellshill would have any local history books or trade directories relating to old businesses in the area. If your Gt Grandfather owned the fish shop in Bellshill, you might be able to find something which might indicate his origins in Italy.

Might also be possible to find reference to him if he was a member of a local church in Bellshill. Or his previous residence in Clydebank. If you have his marriage certificate, it will indicate which church he was married in or who officiated.

Helen thank you so much for taking the time to do this - I will look into the fish shop etc in Bellshill... I know he moved on after that and had a shop in Glasgow when he married my great grandmother, I have several addresses for themc from their death certificates and birth certificates of their children (it would appear they moved about a bit which makes it harder) so I will explore further.
Do you have another source of access to the cenus? Are you using Ancestry? All I know of Scottish records is 'Scottish People' ... sorry for all the questions, I'm still learning!
Thanks again Helen
Sharon

Sharon,

Yes, the census information is from Ancestry. No sign of him prior to 1891.

I also looked into the Incoming Passenger Lists and there is no sign of Giovanni.

Have you tried looking for a obituary notice in the Glasgow newspapers. Maybe it would mention where he originally came from.

Just noticed in the 1901 census, I omitted to put your Gt Grandfather as 'Head' of the household.

Looks like he maybe owned the fish shop.

Never thought of that Helen, thats exactly what I'll do...
Thanks again, enjoy the rest of your night.

Sharon

Just seen your last message, looks like he must have owned it ... a trip to Bellshill library is probably needed - I just googled it and they have local history books so I'll look into that.
Sharon

Sharon,

Just in case you don't know,

The Mitchell Library in Glasgow will have all the Glasgow newspapers.

And the trade directories for the Glasgow area.

You will also be able to check the 1911 valuation rolls (by name) to see where Giovanni was living then.

If he was buried with a headstone, it also might indicate where he came from.

Helen

The Mitchell library is handy for me so I'll go see what I can find out.
I would love to find out where he was buried...
You've been very helpful Helen...
Sharon x

Helen... if you read this again would you mind searching the 1891 census again on the Lizzie Bellonzi stated below? Tried to put my card details into Ancestry but it's not matching my address with card info for some reason so will ring them tommorrow.
Scotlands people is showing it as a Luizi Bellonzi... I was convinced that was a male!! Might show more info....
Thanks again
Sharon

1891 - No gender listed for Lizzie - it would be clear from which col age was in on original image from SP

What Ancestry has re incoming passenger lists is:

This database is an index to the Board of Trade’s passenger lists of ships arriving in the United Kingdom from foreign ports outside of Europe and the Mediterranean from 1878-1888 and 1890-1960. Information listed on the passenger lists may include: name of passenger, their birth date or age, port of departure, port of arrival, date of arrival, and vessel name.

so unless your guy hopped on an inbound ship from India or Aus or wherever if it stopped in Bari or whatever, then you won't find him, which will almost surely be your situation.

Sharon,

Ancestry have some deplorable mistranscriptions regarding census details so think your Luizi Bellonzi may well turn out to be correct.

When you go to the Mitchell, you will be able to view the 'original' 1891 census from the roll of film ... for free ! Exactly the same as the one you would pay for on Scotlandspeople.

ALL the census details from Glasgow are available. 1841 - 1901.

Helen

For ref:


1891 Scotland Census
about Lizzie Bellonzi
Name: Lizzie Bellonzi
Age: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1866
Relationship: Servt (Servant)
Where born: (Naturalized), Italy
Registration Number: 501
Registration district: Old Kilpatrick
Civil Parish: Old Kilpatrick
Town: Clydebank
County: Dumbartonshire
Address: 2 Kilbowie Ro
Occupation: Ice Cream Salesman
ED: 13
Household schedule number: 150
Line: 23
Roll: CSSCT1891_162
Household Members:
Name Age
Frank Cameron 31
Annie Cameron 24
George Goraham 25
Giovanni Bellonzi 18
Lizzie Bellonzi 25

Great.... thanks both..
Sharon