Genealogy Chat

Fanny,
I know his father was also William (from his marriage cert in 1887).
I have traced him in 1911, 1901, 1891 possibly have him in 1881 and 1871 but different ages and pobs given.

hadn't realised dobs were not on certs in 1922. Will have to look at that burial record at the archives in Wolverhampton to see if that gives anything away.

Thank you

ps. There were two daughters born to his wife Ellen Lloyd before they married. Ann Lloyd/Palmer and Violet Mary Matilda Lloyd/Palmer they are both baptised as Lloyd but took the name Palmer later. Violet's marriage is recorded with both.

I dont think birth dates were included on death certs until the middle 1960s.
About 1967 I think.

I just thought maybe you could trace him back through census with his fathers name etc and maybe get a clearer idea of exactly when and where he was born..

He seems to have married after the first child was born in 1887?

Janet, will PM you

Fanny

I have a year of birth varying between 1852 and 1859 throughout the census' with a different birthplaces. His age at marriage doesn't help much so I was hoping the death record would give a birth date to narrow it down a little.

If I have the correct death record, the burial record matches the details, but he is not at the family home.

Does his marriage cert not help with fathers name and occupation and his own declared age on it?
Also maybe witnesses are Palmer family members?

What details do you have for your grandfathers birth.I am in Shropshire archives regularly and could have a look for you.

One more question

If someone died in the Workhouse, who would be the informant on the death certificate? A family member or workhouse staff?

Sylvia

your reply made me smile. It reminds me of the old nursery ryhme "Miss Polly had a Dolly". Do you remember it?

Pat

Thank you for your comments, I hope to get to Wolverhampton Archives in the next month so can do some checking up.

Once I can get some info which helps me, I will post it on here.

Dee

Wolverhampton workhouse had an infirmary (like a lot of workhouses then). The workhouse later became New Cross Hospital.
Walsall workhouse had an infirmary it later became the Manor Hospital.

Some burials were at Merrivale cemetery.

If you do find his date of death then
just ring Wolverhampton Council and ask for bereavement services, they'll look in the records and give you an answer in minutes.
Hope that helps.

By the way I was shocked to find my Gr grandfather had died in a workhouse but at the side it said infirmary. ordinary people just could not afford to pay for hospitals

Pat

the age given on a death certificate is only the age as known by the informant


......... so is not always correct



Re the workhouse


............................... the workhouse often had the only hospital in the area, and it was free ................... so poor poeple would go there because they couldn't pay the fees at the city hospital, and probably not even the doctor's fees


don't forget this is way before National Health came in (1947), and one had to pay for all medical attention ............. except at the workhouse hospital, if there was one.


My brother had required months of doctor's care about 1943 or so ........... my parents were still paying the bill in the 1950s. Even though NHS had been instituted in 1947, it did not cover medical services obtained before that date.

The "doctor's man" used to call every week, and mark down the payment in his little "black book"



sylvia

Jacqueline

Thank you, I am only guessing the death as I couldn't find another which fits the right age at the right time. W'ton archives had a burial on 30/12/1922 which is where I have a date from.

I will try and locate the workhouse and see if there are any records.. Thankyou for the advice.
Dee

My grandmother had a couple of children in the workhouse, so did my great aunt in the 1920's, it was probably the nearest thing to a hospital for the poor, but they did have homes too.

Could be your chap was ill and the family could not give him the care he needed?

Workhouses have records. I managed to find quite a bit of info for my great aunt who had her baby in the Islington Workhouse, like admission and discharge dates. Try the Wolverhapton workhouse records, you know his death date so it should not be too difficult. and maybe you can find additional information and see if it is the right chap.

Good Luck

Yes, that is what I always thought, so maybe this certificated is the wrong one....again.
I am really struggling with finding his death.
Will have to look again and again

Thankyou Ann

the workhouse usually meant they were without means to support themselves - paupers in other words

I have a brick wall with my gt grandfather William Palmer. He was born in Shropshire but gives different ages on the census' and his birth year ranges between 1852 & 1859 in different parishes, so trying to find his baptism and parentage is difficult. So I thought, find his death and hopefully it will give his birth date or at least narrow his birth year down.

I have already ordered 2 wrong certificates and have just applied to the GRO for another, cross checking this time with his family address and occupation ie, 24 Coven Street, Wolverhampton occupation being a waggoner/carter. The record office said that the criteria didn't match the certificate. I phoned them up and they said they would put the application through again this time lifting the occupation on the cross check as he was sometimes down as a labourer. Now he would have been 70 in 1922 which is when the death occured and his wife was still at the family home in this year so I am pretty certain that the address is right.

So whilst I wait for the application to go through again, I thought I would re-check the Wolverhampton archives site which has a listing of buriels. On doing so, I find a burial on 30/12/1922 of a William Palmer age 70 years labourer, but the place given as his address is "Workhouse" What does this mean? could it be a hospital/nursing home? Maybe this is the cert I am looking for and he wasn't at home? in which case the cross check will fail again!

Does anyone know the definition of "workhouse" why would he be in a workhouse when he had family and a home?

Ideas would be appreciated. Thank you.
Dee