Genealogy Chat

A question for members of the GR family with experience in tracking down grave sites.

For the period,say 1880 to 1900,was it common for "ordinary folk" ie modest income only,to provide headstones for deceased family members,or was the price prohibitive for a large percentage of the population ?

Being an Australian resident,I have not actually wandered through any UK cemeteries,hence I am unaware of how many unmarked graves one might encounter in a cemetery in say Dorset or the Rhondda valley.

TV documentaries,touching on genealogy,can give the impression that anyone who sets out to find a grave will find a headstone of some sort.

Thanks, Shirley.

More ordinary people than you would imagine did have headstones, however there are lots of others who simply couldn't afford it.

That doesn't mean to say you can't find the actual grave site. Most councils or cemetery offices have all their burial details on computer now and can quickly find where a person is buried if you have a good idea of when the person died (i.e. if you have the death certificate).

At our local cemetery you can just give them a surname and they will print out a list of all people with that surname who are buried in their cemetery. If one of your ancestors is on the list then they will give you a small printed map of the cemetery with the approximate place marked or someone from the cemetery staff with take to to the correct place and show you the burial plot - even if there is no headstone.

Kath. x

Hi Kathleen,

you are lucky where is the cemetery you are interested in? Enfield and Harringey Council will not let you look at the records either in the cemeteries or in their offices - they site "Freedom of Information Act" what nonsense I went to Putney Vale, sat in their offices and looked at the original entries of burials/cremations.

It seems to me a way of making money as they want £20 to search for each person, I know dates of death of several ancestors but there are many places they could have been laid to rest.

The cemetary I was talking about is Stranton Cemetery in Hartlepool in the north-east of England. The lady who works there is really, really helpful and has spent a lot of her own time getting the information from the old record books onto disc and computer and she is always more than happy to help.

I have also been given similar help from Saltwell cemetery in Gateshead, Tyne and Wear. I have never had to pay for any of the help I have received - which is perhaps not the norm in most places but in the North-East is much more likely to happen.

Kath. x

Just to add I have also had free help in finding graves/burials from Lincoln City Council and Bridgend Library in Glamorgan. Both the burials were in 'Municipal Cemeteries'.
I e-mailed them for help in finding graves with a short story about the people I was looking for and they both came up trumps.

Jennifer

Sadly some churchyards have now gone for the 'open plan' look, perhaps to aid maintenance and I've seen headstones stacked at the outer boundary walls, with just a few graves with kerb stone surrounds still in situ.

If you find them though, there can sometimes be interesting results.
I was surprised to find that my great grandfather was buried with his 1st wife ( my great grandmother ) even though he had married again and the 2nd wife was still alive when he died.
....Wonder what she thought about that?

Gwyn

Perhaps he had already paid for the plot Gwyn and had asked to be buried there. I think a lot of second wives in earlier times were much more tolerant of the fact that their husbands had been married before and were quite willing to accept them and their children.

We recently found that one of my husband's great-grandfathers went to America and joined the American Army and fought in the Mexican War of 1846 and after he died a headstone was sent over to England for him by the American Authorities. They even had a special service which was attended by the American Consul in the area.

Made a bit of a change from our usual Agricultural Labourers!!

Kath. x

What a great find Kath !

I find gravestones very interesting. Sometimes you get other family members mentioned, with a note that they are buried in some far-off place.
There are some interesting one's locally relating to certain disasters at sea, when the whole scenario is recorded.

I think the most informative individual ones I've seen were in Ireland, where you might get a man's name, occupation, address besides his birth and death dates, then a string of family names who would remember him.


Gwyn

I agree they can be really helpful.

We once found a headstone of one of my male ancestors which must have been erected quite a long time after his death because it also had added his wife's name and date of death (which we already knew) and also four of his children's names and dates of death (which we didn't know).

The headstone that came from America also gave his wife's name and date of death even though she had died 8 years before him, so the American Authorities must have been in touch with someone over here to get this information. This American connection was found because of a recent Hot Match connection on Genes - so they DO sometimes work (even though most of us moan about them).

p.s. Sorry to hijack your thread Shirley :-)

Kath. x

Search on this site - Tips - for:

UK Cemetary websites (poster is George)

Also try one of my favourites:

gravestonephotos.com for UK, Australia and other countries.

Lots of records available - just ask.

Good luck

Reece

I had the exact position of my grandad's first wife's grave (this is at Hollybrook cemetery, Southampton) - even knew what to look for (thanks to letters between my grandparents), but when I got there - someone elses headstone was in situ!
Apparently in this burial ground, even if you buy the site, it's only yours for 30 years! After that time, (unless, I presume you pay more money), anyone else can be buried in the same plot!
I was very disappointed, as my grandad had scrimped and saved on a docker's wage to get the green 'glass' for the grave.
The '30 year rule' is a recent innovation I'm led to believe (last 20 years or so)

I think most cemeteries have the same rule about "buying" graves. You only have them from between 25 and 75 years I think. I know we had to pay again after 25 years for my dad's plot. I don't think you even get a reminder - you have to remember to pay when the time comes.

EDIT - just found this on a website about buying a plot:-

Do not be surprised if the office tells you that you can not buy a burial plot outright, but instead can buy the exclusive rights to that land for a certain number of years (usually between 25 and 100 years). This is a typical situation. It means that you will be awarded a Grant of Exclusive Right of Burial (or similar) and will then be the only person able to bury in that plot for the number of years you have purchased. Often there will be the option to renew the Grant for another number of years if necessary.

Kath. x

In reply to headstones the portsmouth office gave me maps they never offered to show me my grandparents graves eventually after my fourth attempt of looking a stranger who was with a friend helped me find the plot which had no headstone on it at all
also another grave in another cemetary was hard to find i took a friend to find hers and she found my other grandparents as well it was in very good condition also i found a war grave which had my uncle buried in someone elses grave

goodness knows were his wife is buried

Joyce

Thank you all for your contributions.

Taking all the data into consideration,I should be realistic [as opposed to optimistic] in my expectations,as to how much time I could consume during a visit the family trip to the UK later this year.

Shirley.