Genealogy Chat

Does anyone know where to trace the date of death from army pension records?

I'm trying to find the death for Thomas Williams (aka Frederick Thomas Williams) born about 1834 St Pauls, Bristol. He served in the Royal Artillery in India after fighting in the Crimea. He was discharged on 11 June 1887 in Bombay. I have copies of his pension records up to that point from Find my Past.

I'm assuming that there would be some record of the pension finishing when he died - any ideas on where to look? Have the records even survived?

I don't know if he died in India or back in England - unfortunately with a name like Thomas Williams trying to find his death record is like looking for a needle in a haystack especially without a definite year of death!!

Thank you

Might be worth trying to trace him on the following three census assuming he came back to England.

Chances are he might be noted on the census as a Chelsea Pensioner or Pensioner ... they usually are.

Might help narrow down his death date and location.

I am looking at the 1891 census for him - do his discharge papers give next of kin? Do you know his wife's name? Do you know when she died? There is a Thomas Williams age 55 in Bedminster, Bristol with wife Sarah, there is a widowed 57-year-old Thomas Williams in Silver Street, Bristol and a 55-year-old Thomas Williams in Newport with wife Charlotte.

Thanks for your help. Thomas's wife was a Clara Agnes but she remarried in India in 1890 (from her 2nd husband's army records) - presumably after Thomas died. However there is a family photograph supposedly of Thomas, Clara Agnes and their daughter Lily Irene (who was born in India in 1888) - the child looks about 4 years old and the photograph was thought to have been taken in 1891/2. The man is in uniform and wearing medals which match Thomas's - he looks nothing like the 2nd husband. Nothing quite adds up which suggests some deception or bigamy etc!
I've already tried the censuses thanks but not been able to find a clear match. I've also tried online Indian records. The only thing I can think of now is to find when the pension stopped - (I know his army number etc) but don't know where to find it.

You could try asking Ann Swabey for advice - she is here - http://www.militaryandfamilyresearch.co.uk/index.htm
and my reference is the second one in her site :-)

A branch of my family has "army people" in it. I'm only on the edges, so I didn't go into it in detail, but another member of the family did, and has given me to believe that in the 1800s, it was totally unacceptable to have illegitimate children or marry a second time without proof of the first spouse dying.

Could the man have been a relative of Thomas or the child's godfather?

Thanks Joy for the website - it looks very hopeful.
Madmeg - I agree about the illegitimacy and remarriage but there has definitely been something strange going on in this case. A family member has Thomas's original discharge papers and the age has been altered to 20yrs 6mths when according to the date he was actually 53years old and described as having grey hair!! He was also in trouble earlier in his army career with court cases mentioned in his army records and reduced pension!! He was said to be a black sheep by family members. His wife was 25 years younger and her 2nd husband her own age. The second husband served in similar places to Thomas and was also in the Royal Artillery. There is a comment on Thomas's medical record which would bring into question his fertility. The couple had been married 9 years before the first and only child was born. I suspect he may not have been the father! It's all very intriguing but I'm struggling to get to the bottom of it!