Genealogy Chat

My Great Grand Father James Hall married a Alice Day in 1877
the first born son was named Joseph Hall Grimshaw as was all following sons had Hall in between christian and surname,On the marriage certificate there were 2 witnesses a Priscilla Day Alice`s sister and a Thomas Grimshaw, only just found out that he had changed his name through the marriage cert.So any one come up with an answer other than he must have been illigitmate as there was no fathers name on it, could his mother have married a Grimshaw shortly before the birth of the first son Many Thanks Pauline

So this is the family?

1881 England Census
about James Grimshaw
Name: James Grimshaw
Age: 22
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1859
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Alice Grimshaw
Gender: Male
Where born: Pendlebury, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Worsley
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address: 2 Wardley St
Condition as to marriage: Married
Education:

Employment status: View image
Occupation: Coal Miner

Registration district: Barton Upon Irwell
Sub-registration district: Worsley
ED, institution, or vessel: 11
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 3878
Folio: 18
Page Number: 29
Household Members: Name Age
James Grimshaw 22
Alice Grimshaw 24
Joseph Grimshaw 3
James Grimshaw


Dee x

Cheers Dee That was quick
Pauline

Pauline,

James states a birth year of 1859 in 1881......... this would mean he was a minor when he married and would have needed parental consent, so does it give his age on the marriage certificate?

I see that Joseph, James and Clifford and with Grandparent Day house in 1891...... what happened to James and Alice?

1871 England Census
about James Grimshaw
Name: James Grimshaw
Age: 12
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1859
Relation: Son
Father's name: Samuel Grimshaw
Mother's name: Ellen Grimshaw
Gender: Male
Where born: Pendlebury, Lancashire, England
Civil parish: Pendlebury
Ecclesiastical parish: Pendlebury Christchurch
Town: Pendlebury
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Registration district: Salford
Sub-registration district: Pendleton
ED, institution, or vessel: 35
Household schedule number: 94
Piece: 4012
Folio: 157
Page Number: 15
Household Members: Name Age
Samuel Grimshaw 39
Ellen Grimshaw 37
James Grimshaw 12
Elisabeth Grimshaw 6
Herbert Grimshaw 8 Months
Samuel Ashton 17

1861 England Census
about James Grimshaw
Name: James Grimshaw
Age: 2
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1859
Relation: Grandson
Mother's name: Ann Grimshaw
Gender: Male
Where born: Pendlebury, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Pendlebury
Ecclesiastical parish: Eccles
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View image

Registration district: Salford
Sub-registration district: Pendleton
ED, institution, or vessel: 30
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 93
Piece: 2907
Folio: 91
Page Number: 22
Household Members: Name Age
Richard Grimshaw 80
Ann Grimshaw 65
Samuel Grimshaw 30
Ellen Grimshaw 27
Ann Grimshaw 23
James Grimshaw 2
Sarah Ashton 8
Samuel Ashton 7

SatNav............ think that 1 is still at home in 1881

Yes James Hall Married Alice in 1877 aged 18 she was aged 20
her father is on the cert but nothing for him, thats what makes me think he was born out of wedlock so if he was only 18 his mother would still be young ,38 or so, and with there being a Thomas Grimshaw as a witness
Could it be that this is his Step Father to be as when Joseph the first son was born in 1878 he is named Joseph Hall Grimshaw, next came James Hall my grandfather and so it went on each child had Hall in their name.
But when my grand father married he did not carry the tradition on
Pauline

England & Wales, FreeBMD Marriage Index: 1837-1915
about Samuel Grimshaw Name: Samuel Grimshaw
Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1860
Registration district: Barton Upon Irwell
Registration county (inferred): Lancashire
Volume Number: 8c
Page Number: 630 (click to see others on page)

One of the 'others on the page' was Ellen Hall

On the 1861 Ancestry census Ann is given as James' mother but that is a mistranscript. She is the daughter of the head of house. James is the grandson of head of house, Samuel the son and Ellen daughter- in - law.

Vera

so Samuel Grimshaw and Ellen Hall married in the December quarter 1860

according to the 1861 Census, James grimshaw was age 2 in 1861, meaning he was born about 1859


so it does look as though he was born before Ellen married Samuel, but that he took on Samuel's surname after the marriage.



look'ee here .... from Lancashire online parish clerks

www.lan-opc.org.uk/


Baptisms: 1 Jan 1860 Christ Church, Pendlebury, Lancashire, England

James Grimshaw - Child of Samuel Grimshaw & Ellen
Born: 4 Mar 1859
Abode: Pendlebury
Occupation: Labourer
Baptised by: Alfd. Dewes
Register: Baptisms 1859 - 1869, Page 2, Entry 10
Source: LDS Film 2356040




so it looks as though he WAS Samuel's child, but born before their marriage. When he was baptised, Samuel claimed parentage.




sylvia

Hall /Grimshaw
Many thanks for all the feed back I have had,there is an awful
lot of good people out there,ready to help, After so long thiking your great
grand parents were named Grimshaw and to find out he changed it ,after1877, still not worked it out yet Cheers Pauline

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England & Wales, FreeBMD Birth Index, 1837-1915
about James Hall
Name: James Hall
Year of Registration: 1859
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
District: Salford
County: Greater Manchester, Lancashire
Volume: 8d
Page: 4

James Hall
Hi satnav many thanks for your reply I have looked this one up.
And I think I will have to send off for the birth cert,be it the right one
or not, His Father is not named on his marriage cert, so I will still
draw a blank if it is not on the birth Cheers Pauline

Pauline

I note that between the 1861 and 1871 there was a move for some members of the Grimshaw family to Mining from the Mills.but remaining in the Pendlebury area.

Vera