Genealogy Chat

Hi can anyone help me please?

Mary Ann Evans married William Hyde at St Martin's Birmngham on 17 April 1853. Mary's age at marriage was 27 and her father was shown as William Evans (Gardening). William's age at marriage was also 27 and his father John Hyde also a gardener.

Firstly Mary Ann.

I can't find her in 1841 or 1851 census. The 1861 census shows birthplace as Bewdley 1826 and subsequently in 1871 to 1891 Kidderminster. I can find a christening in Kidderminster on 26/04/1826 duaghter of William and Mary.

I never find William and Mary in any census - or at least not one who was a gardener.

And then William - I can't find him in 1841 census (I find him as a servant in 1851) and never find John his father. A christening record in Little Malvern shows mother Harriet. The only Harriet I can find marrying a John Hyde is Harriett Mucklow but they emigrated to the States when William would have been seven years old (and had a son there which they named William) so I don't think this is them.

So can anyone out there find William and Mary Ann before they married - and/or their parents?

All help gratefully received!

:-)

Hi Judith,

who were the witnesses to their marriage, was there a family connection to them?

Dee x

The witnesses were James and Elizabeth Reynolds as far as I can make out. I know not of any connection. I have tried searching but have not found any connection

I have just found an Elizabeth Sarah Hyde, daughter of John and Harriet born 1824 in Little Malvern. So I am guessing this could be William's sister. But I can't find a marriage that would make her Reynolds

I wonder if this is a possible brother for William?

1851 England Census
about Robert Hyde Name: Robert Hyde
Age: 28
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1823
Relation: Lodger
Gender: M (Male)
Where born: Great Malvern, Worcestershire, England

Civil parish: Great Malvern
County/Island: Worcestershire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View image

Registration district: Upton On Severn
Sub-registration district: Hanley
ED, institution, or vessel: 5b
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 30
Piece: 2043
Folio: 130
Page Number: 9
Household Members: Name Age
Robert Holmgard 31
Delia Holmgard 35
Delia Holmgard 16
Susanna Holmgard 5
Robert Hyde 28
John Franks 20
Thomas Philpotts 27
George Cavis 26


Name: Robert Hyde
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date: 19 May 1822
Baptism/Christening Place: Worcester, England
Birth Date:
Birthplace:
Death Date:
Name Note:
Race:
Father's Name: John Hyde
Father's Birthplace:
Father's Age:
Mother's Name: Harriett
Mother's Birthplace:
Mother's Age:
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: I04360-7
System Origin: England-EASy
Source Film Number: 350589
Reference Number:


Dee x

See amendment to my post - found an Elizabeth Sarah

I'll have a nosey about for a Hyde Reynolds marriage.

This is Roberts marriage;

Dorset, England, Marriages and Banns, 1813-1921
about Robert Hyde Name: Robert Hyde >> Stud groom
Marriage or Bann Date: 31 Dec 1867
Parish: Bryanston
Father's name: John Hyde >>> Coachman
Spouse's Name: Diana Mills Dening
Spouse's Father's Name: John Dening


Although the father isn't a gardener don't be put off, as I see Williams occupation in 1851 was a Footman........ all in a very similar circle!!

Possible other siblings


JANE HYDE - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 14 JUL 1816 Alfrick And Lulsley, Worcester, England

GEORGE HYDE - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 23 NOV 1818 Saint Marys, Hanley Castle, Worcester, England

Given the first child of John and Harriet appears to born in 1814 I wonder if this a possible marriage for them?

Groom's Name: John Hyde
Groom's Birth Date:
Groom's Birthplace:
Groom's Age:
Bride's Name: Harriett Gale
Bride's Birth Date:
Bride's Birthplace:
Bride's Age:
Marriage Date: 09 Feb 1813
Marriage Place: Ganarew,Hereford,England

Thanks everyone! K - I had considered that marriage to Harriett Gale although I have not looked into it deeply.

Re Elizabeth Hyde born Malvern Wells - who looks a good contender for a sister, she appears not to have married (I can find her in two censuses living with Mary Tansley - sister). But I can't find a Mary Ann Hyde who could be a sister and daughter of Harriett and John.

But I have got a few possible leads to follow up on!

:-)

A breakthrough! Elizabeth Hyde - born Malvern Wells 1824 , daughter of John and Harriett- appears not to have married and in 1891 census is living with Mary Tansley - sister. I can't find a birth yet for Mary Ann Hyde in Malvern Wells in 1821 but in the 1871 census she and husband William have a daughter named Harriett Gale Tansley...so K I think your marriage is correct! And in 1891 census also at the house with Elizabeth and Mary Ann is niece Harriett Hyde born in Dorset who must I guess be Robert's daughter...all connecting slowly! :-)

Brilliant!! I live on the edge of Worcestershire and could pop in the Family History Centre or Hereford Record Office at some point if you are stuck.

As their first child was born in Alfrick/Lulsley, along the road from me, I wondered if this could be John

JOHN HYDE Pedigree
Male
Christening:
19 MAY 1782 Alfrick And Lulsley, Worcester, England
Parents:
Father: JOHN HYDE Family
Mother: HANNAH

Oh yes that sounds good...I can find a Mary Hyde born Hanley Castle 1819 - which fits in with George's birth. I can't find a marriage to William Tansley for Mary Hyde but can find one for Mary Watts so wonder if she was married earlier..though haven't found that one yet!

Whereabouts is Lower Mitton in relation to you?

I wonder if this is William in 1841? Listed as an Ag Lab

NOTT, Robert M 50 1791
NOTT, Mary F 40 1801 VIEW
NOTT, Louisa F 15 1826 Worcestershire
NOTT, Robert M 13 1828 Worcestershire
HODGES, Charles M 7 1834 Worcestershire
KELLEY, William M 40 1801 Ireland
O BRION, Catherine F 30 1811 Ireland
DAVIS, Mary F 35 1806 Worcestershire
PEW, Elenor F 45 1796
MATHEWS, Mary F 60 1781 Worcestershire
HIDE, William M 15 1826 Worcestershire
RG number:
HO107 Piece:
1205 Book/Folio:
1/43 Page:
12

Registration District:
Upton upon Severn Sub District:
Hanley Castle Enumeration District:
Ecclesiastical Parish:

Civil Parish:
Hanley Castle Municipal Borough:
Address:
Malvern Wells, Hanley Castle County:
Worcestershire

Sorry - our posts crossed. I think Lower Mitton is near Kidderminster - About 12 miles?

Yes I think you're right about this being William. I have a whole raft of people from Lower Mitton/Kidderminster/Bewdley...

Nudging...since this thread I have moved on enormously with the Hydes. I never did find a birth for Mary but there are too many connections for her not to have been a sister to William.

But I have not been able to go further on Mary Ann.

To recap

I cannot find her before her marriage to William on 17/04/1853.

At marriage - aged 27 = 1826

1861 census aged 35 (1826) born Bewdeley
1871 census aged 45 (1826) born Worcestershire
1881 census aged 54 (1827) born Kidderminster
1891 census aged 65 (1826) Kidderminster
1899 Death aged 72 = 1827

I think this could be her christening

residence:Kidderminster, Worcester, England
parents:William Evans, Mary
record title:England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
name:Mary Evans
gender:Female
baptism/christening date:26 Apr 1826
baptism/christening place:Kidderminster, Worcester, England
father's name:William Evans
mother's name:Mary
indexing project (batch) number:C01320-1
system origin:England-EASy
source film number:350503

I have a "best-guess" at a marriage for William and Mary - William Evans and Mary Small St Martin's Kidderminster 25/05/1825

And I can find a William and Mary in 1841 and 1851 censuses in Kidderminster - occupation dealer in clothes and furniture. And then I can find same William in 1861 as a widower with possible deaths in 1852 or 1858 for Mary.

But this is all guesswork and conjecture. Is there any route for verifying any of this?

:-S

Have to go to work now but have you discounted this Mary in 1851 with mother Mary. From memory Wribbenhall is in Bewdley

1851

Name: Mary Evans
Age: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1826
Relation: Daughter
Mother's Name: Mary Evans
Gender: F (Female)
Where born: Wribbenhall

Civil parish: Kidderminster
Ecclesiastical parish: Wribbenhall
County/Island: Worcestershire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability:

View image

Registration district: Kidderminster
Sub-registration district: Kidderminster
ED, institution, or vessel: 2f
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 9
Piece: 2038
Folio: 628
Page Number: 2
Household Members:
Name Age
Mary Evans 55
Mary Evans 25

This looks good for Mary the daughter. And Mary the mother - born in Atherstone Warwickshire, fits with another marriage I have of Mary Berresford to William Evans 13/02/1826 which is close to Mary (younger) christening in April that year. And I can find a birth for a Mary Beresford in 1796 in Mancetter Warks which is 1.5 miles from Atherstone. [this was actually the first path I went down]

Downside...William appears to be deceased (Mary Head/Widow - although there is a crossing out) and he is not shown as such on marriage certificate though that's not a given as my grandmother's father was deceased when she married and the certificate does not show this.

So next challenge would be to find either Mary and William in 1841.

:-)

Just as a sideline there is this possible sibling in Family Search and a possible Mary in 1841

John Evans
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date: 11 Nov 1827
Baptism/Christening Place: KIDDERMINSTER,WORCESTER,ENGLAND
Birth Date:
Birthplace:
Death Date:
Name Note:
Race:
Father's Name: William Evans
Father's Birthplace:
Father's Age:
Mother's Name: Mary
Mother's Birthplace:
Mother's Age:
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C04395-2
System Origin: England-ODM
Source Film Number: 435276
Reference Number:


1841

about Mary Evens
Name: Mary Evens
Age: 15
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1826
Gender: Female
Where born: Worcestershire, England

Civil parish: Kidderminster
Hundred: Halfshire (Lower Division)
County/Island: Worcestershire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation: View image

Registration district: Kidderminster
Sub-registration district: Kidderminster
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 1197
Book: 13
Folio: 47
Page Number: 23
Household Members: Name Age
Joannah Soley 80
Louisa Russell 65
Thomas Yearsley 50
George Reynolds 45
John Hobbis 30
Mary Childs 45
Elizabeth Wheelwright 45
Sarah Yates 35
Mary Evens 15 listed as FS