Genealogy Chat

please can anyone tell me if a BIRTH cert is needed for anyone who got married around the 1850,ive got a marriage cert fot this person but cant find a birth cert is it possible that the birth cert was never applied for thanks chris

Quote:
In England and Wales, registering a birth has been a legal requirement since 1st July 1837, although penalties for non-registration were not introduced until 1875.

Can you give us name and approximate date so we can have a look for you?
Thanks.

No - a birth certificate wasn't necessary. Civil registration wasn't introduced until Sep 1837, and even then it was the responsibility of the Registrar to record the births.

A person born and registered in 1837 would only have been 13 in 1850, so unlikley to be marrying.

Some churches wouldn't marry a couple unless they were baptised, so a baptism record is another source of information.

No proof like that needed and registration only came in in Sept, 1837 and not compulsory leading to prosecution for non registration 'til around 1870.

My g/grandfather born 1862 in Liverpool, his birth never registered. All his siblings were and he was the youngest. But all were Baptised and their dobs etc. have been found in the local Catholic Church. For years I thought i was going mad, until I was told about the above.

Piglets Pal, that happened to some of my ancestors from Liverpool.

What I found really strange is one of my ancestors from Wigan was christened but couldn't find a birth certificate yet the rest of the children have certificates.

going mad is a understatement,there are 3 of us on genes and ancestry who have been lookin for this person ive only been looking for 3 long days and the other 2 for a lot longer and are more experienced than me but with no luck so patchem i dont want to waste your time,i have her marriage and her children and all the census info right back to 1841 she was known as mary ann alder born c1826 at stanley end, kings stanley gloucestershire.she married a thomas hall in birmingham aound 1850 he was trianing to be a tailor he was born in repton derbyshire ,on her marriage cert father is known as Daniel Dark hes a publican so i presume she was illegitimate,on the birth cert of one of her children she is down as Mary Ann Hall formally Alderdark,so its very complex,as i said i dont want to waste any ones time regards chris

was she married before Christine?

not as far as i know its thought though but ive research the surname Dark and Alderdark and found nothing

Daniel Darke - Licenced Victuller

1841 England Census
about Daniel Darke
Name: Daniel Darke
Age: 35
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1806
Gender: Male
Where born: Gloucestershire, England

Civil parish: Stroud
Hundred: Bisley
County/Island: Gloucestershire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation: View image

Registration district: Stroud
Sub-registration district: Stroud
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 349
Book: 14
Folio: 16
Page Number: 26
Household Members: Name Age
Daniel Darke 35




Andy

yes thats her father thanks chris

Given that 35% of folk in UK lived in areas where there was no civil registration in 1850, it would hardly be practical to demand a b.cert before marr - no male would have one, and I doubt that there were even half a dozen brides with one, given the length of time civil registration was in place for the rest of the UK.

You didn't have to produce a birth certificate when I got married in 1969 so I'm pretty sure you wouldn't have had to in the 1800's

Kath. x

If one looks at the image of that 1841 Census that Andrew posted .... there actually is a whole family of Darkes. Ancestry has just shown them on the record page one by one

Daniel Darke abt 1806 Gloucestershire, England, Stroud, Gloucestershire
Harriett Darke abt 1808 Gloucestershire, England Stroud, Gloucestershire
Richard Darke abt 1826 Gloucestershire, England Stroud, Gloucestershire
Selina Darke abt 1831 Gloucestershire, England Stroud, Gloucestershire
Catharine Darke abt 1832 Gloucestershire, England Stroud, Gloucestershire
Charles Darke abt 1836 Gloucestershire, England Stroud, Gloucestershire
George Darke abt 1840 Gloucestershire, England Stroud Gloucestershire

So what name did she marry in?

( EDit - she married in 1848, not 1850) ALDER

Using http://ww3.gloucestershire.gov.uk/bmd/

Child Surname Child Forename Father Surname Mother Surname Mother's Former Name Year District Office Register Entry
DARKE George Henry DARKE DARKE HILL 1840 Stroud Stroud, Stroud 2 205

Mary Ann wasn't Harriet's child by any chance?

Mary Anne Alder
England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
christening: 07 Mar 1824 Stroud, Gloucester, England
residence: Gloucester, England
parents: Harriette Alder <<<<<<

thanks to everyone who is helping im at work today so i will be back this evening. Ozibid in 1824 would it only be the father who was mentioned on any documentation if only harriette alder is mentioned could it mean that mary ann alder could be illegitimate,if so its sounds very promising,thanks

i know the census i have on mary ann are correct as everything fits nicely.marys age differs from one census to another,i know that depending on which date the census takes place that sometimes the age difference between spouses can change by a year but mary and thomas ages are,1851 thomas is 22 and mary is 27 thats 5 years difference which would make her birth 1824 as Ozibbid found in the christening 1538-1975,(1861 thomas 33 mary 35) (1871 thomas 42 mary 46)(1881 thomas 52 mary 54)(1891 thomas 62 mary 65) if i can find out harriettes drak(1808)maiden name or aif i can find a record of her marriage i could send for her marriage cert which conclude my search thanks again to all out there,chris

Christine


yes, at that time it was only the father's name that was usually shown


If it is the mother's name only, then the child was illegitimate.




sylvia

great sylvia thanks for that its lookoing more positive that my marys mum was harriett,chris