Genealogy Chat

lan-opc has some gaps in their transcriptions for Brownedge Saint Mary - they only have:
Baptisms for the period 1764 to 1789 and 1856 to 1931
Marriages for the period 1764 to 1845 and 1869 to 1939 (No Wm+Eliz in 1844)
Deaths for the period 1764 to 1848 and 1856 to 1920

The rego's for the gaps seem to be missing, see:
http://www.lancashire.gov.uk/media/898309/B.pdf
accessed via:
http://www.lancashire.gov.uk/libraries-and-archives/archives-and-record-office/search-the-archives/church-registers-guide.aspx

Using http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/
Baptism: 7 Dec 1862 Brownedge St Mary, Bamber Bridge, Lancashire, England
Jacobus Waterhouse - filius Gulielmi Waterhouse & Elizabeth (formerly Leech)
Born: 3 Dec 1862
Godparents: Thomas Turner; Helena Roberts
Baptised by: Thoma Walker Misso. Aposo.
Register: Baptisms 1856 - 1883, Page 62, Entry 307
Source: Original register at Lancashire Archives

Death: 10 Jan 1863 Brownedge St Mary, Bamber Bridge, Lancs.
Jacobus Waterhouse -
Burial: 13 Jan 1863
Age: 5 heb.
Abode: Punch Row
Buried by: Thomas Walker Misss. Aposs.
Register: Liber Defunctorum 1856 - 1870, Page 81, Entry 403
Source: Original register at Lancashire Archives
[I think this is our James, since he died 38 d after our birth, which accords with an age at death of 5 weeks]
[NB hebdomas is week - I don't know what the fem plural ending is]

Death: 24 Dec 1861 Brownedge St Mary, Bamber Bridge, Lancs.
Isabella Waterhouse -
Burial: 28 Dec 1861
Age: 18
Abode: Punch Row
Sacraments Administered: Yes
Buried by: Thomas Walker Misss. Aposs.
Register: Liber Defunctorum 1856 - 1870, Page 71, Entry 351
Source: Original register at Lancashire Archives
[On 24/12/1861, our Isa is 17, but given the addy, I think this is our lass]

Death: 19 Sep 1870 Brownedge St Mary, Bamber Bridge, Lancs.
Elizabeth Waterhouse -
Burial: 22 Sep 1870
Age: 44
Abode: Withy Trees
Sacraments Administered: Yes
Buried by: Thomas Walker Miss. Apos.
Register: Liber Defunctorum 1870 - 1894, Page 7, Entry 34
Source: Original register at Lancashire Archives

Lancashire Death indexes for the years: 1870
Surname Forename(s) Age or Date of Birth Sub-District Registers At Reference
WATERHOUSE Elizabeth 44 Walton-le-Dale Preston WLD/13/24

Death: 19 Sep 1870 Brownedge St Mary, Bamber Bridge, Lancs.
Elizabeth Waterhouse -
Burial: 22 Sep 1870
Age: 44
Abode: Withy Trees
Sacraments Administered: Yes
Buried by: Thomas Walker Miss. Apos.
Register: Liber Defunctorum 1870 - 1894, Page 7, Entry 34
Source: Original register at Lancashire Archives

This age matches the 2 censuses better.

-------------------------------

Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1844
Surname Forename(s) Surname Forename(s) Church / Register Office Registers At Reference
WATERHOUSE William LEACH Elizabeth Preston Register Office or Registrar Attended Preston PRESTON/6/141

Until 1898, only C of E (plus jews, quakers and registrars) were authorized to keep official marr rego's, so a non-conformist marr would need a registrar to attend so the couple could sign his official rego to complete the ceremony.
Of course, non-conformists could keep their own unofficial marr rego's. Brownedge St Mary did, but there's no entry for this marr.
Since Elizabeth was from Preston, the marr could well have taken place there.

Anyway, by abt 1905 most non-conformist churches were authorized to keep official marr rego's, although the RCs chose not to apply until 1980-ish.

Esther -
Here's the 1851 FS hit for Mary Ann
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGY7-HG7
On abt half of the census years (incl 1851), FS gives the full ref, viz:
Piece/Folio 2268 / 197 Page Number 48

On both Ancestry & FMP, one can search by the census ref, but only if one uses the search page specific to that census

England
1841 http://search.ancestry.co.uk/search/db.aspx?dbid=8978
1851 http://search.ancestry.co.uk/search/db.aspx?dbid=8860
1861 http://search.ancestry.co.uk/search/db.aspx?dbid=8767
1871 http://search.ancestry.co.uk/search/db.aspx?dbid=7619
1881 http://search.ancestry.co.uk/search/db.aspx?dbid=7572
1891 http://search.ancestry.co.uk/search/db.aspx?dbid=6598
1901 http://search.ancestry.co.uk/search/db.aspx?dbid=7814
1911 http://search.ancestry.co.uk/search/db.aspx?dbid=2352

FMP
1841 http://search.findmypast.co.uk/search-world-Records/1841-england-wales-and-scotland-census
(1851-1901 are same as above except for date)
1911 http://search.findmypast.co.uk/search-world-Records/1911-census-for-england-and-wales

So, to look up an adjacent page by census ref, first of all adjust the page number by one.
Half the time, this is enough, but if you get no hits, then also adjust the folio number by one in the same direction.
This procedure will give all the mames on the adjacent page.

FS uses the FMP transcription, so we can then use FMP's version of the name for an FS lookup.

Heres the missing part of the 1851 h/h:
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGY7-HG9

**************************

1861 https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7TD-G1Z
William Waterhouse Head M 37 Church, Lancashire
Elizabeth Waterhouse Wife F 37 Preston, Lancashire
Isabella Waterhouse Daughter F 17 Walton, Lancashire
Agnes Waterhouse Daughter F 14 Walton, Lancashire
Marian Waterhouse Daughter F 6 Blackburn, Lancashire
Elizabeth Waterhouse Daughter F 2 Walton, Lancashire

Births Sep 1854 (>99%)
WATERHOUSE Mary Ann Blackburn 8e 299

I can find no new GRO index hit, but:
Lancashire Birth indexes for the years: 1854
Surname Forename(s) Mother's Maiden Name Sub-District Registers At Reference
WATERHOUSE Mary Ann LEACH Blackburn Blackburn B/58/43

Now it would be odd to name two kids Mary Ann, so lets look for a death of the first kid


Deaths Dec 1851 (>99%)
Waterhouse Mary Ann Preston 21 525
------------
CAMPBELL Archibald Preston 21 525
CAMPBELL William Preston 21 525
CROOK William Preston 21 525

I've added some other names from the same GRO page

A lookup of the new GRO index gives
WATERHOUSE, MARY ANN 15 Order
GRO Reference: 1851 D Quarter in PRESTON Volume 21 Page 525

Using the info inky's post gives on 1851, Mary Ann would be 14 m old at Xmas 1851, so one wonders if the GRO age is 15m, rather than 15y asthey state.

Lancashire Death indexes for the years: 1851
Surname Forename(s) Age or Date of Birth Sub-District Registers At Reference
WATERHOUSE Mary Ann 1 Walton-le-Dale Preston WLD/6/4
---------
CAMPBELL Archibald 5 Walton-le-Dale Preston WLD/6/3
CAMPBELL William 3 Walton-le-Dale Preston WLD/6/3
CROOK William 65 Walton-le-Dale Preston WLD/6/4

I've included the same extra names.
We need to confirm the GRO index and LanBMF are talking abt the same entry.
Most local refs have 3 elements:
1) a code identifying the subdistrict for Bs and Ds, or the church for Ms;
2) a sequence number identifying the register within that subdistrict or church (most local registers had 500 entries);
3) a page or entry number.
Most local refs use an entry # for Ms (so one knows who wed whom), and a page # for Bs and Ds.
The local rego's always had 5 entries per page for Bs and Ds, and 2 for Ms.
In 1837, the pages for the GRO copies had twice as many entries per page as the local rego's had, but this was decreased to 2 per page for Ms in 1852q1, and 5 per page for Bs and Ds in 1912q1.

So an 1851 GRO Ds page would have 10 consecutive entries which could extend over 3 local pages (or parts thereof).
Clearly, the local deaths I've listed are within 10 entries of each other, so I'm confident I've found the matching local entry for the GRO hit.
The local entry says the age of death is some age which rounds down to 1 year, which lends credence to the supposition the original entry and the GRO copy say her age was 15m.

Ancestry 1851 Her age of 7 months was mistranscribed as 7 years.

Name:
Mary Ann Waterhouse
Age:
7
Estimated birth year:
abt 1844
Relation:
Daughter
Father's name:
Willm Waterhouse
Mother's name:
Elizth Waterhouse
Gender:
Female
Where born:
Walton-le-Dale, Lancashire, England

http://www.mytrees.com/ancestry-family/al001702-3691-9501/William-WATERHOUSE-Born-1807-in-England.html

(above from google search, if William)

Chris :)

Baptism: 23 May 1858 Brownedge St Mary, Bamber Bridge, Lancashire, England
Elizabeth Waterhouse - filia Gulielmi Waterhouse & Elizabeth (formerly Leach)
Born: 23 May 1858
Godparents: Daniel Livsey; Anna Grime
Baptised by: Thoma Walker Misso. Aposo.
Register: Baptisms 1856 - 1883, Page 24, Entry 119
Source: Original register at Lancashire Archives


Baptism: 7 Dec 1862 Brownedge St Mary, Bamber Bridge, Lancashire, England
Jacobus Waterhouse - filius Gulielmi Waterhouse & Elizabeth (formerly Leech)
Born: 3 Dec 1862
Godparents: Thomas Turner; Helena Roberts
Baptised by: Thoma Walker Misso. Aposo.
Register: Baptisms 1856 - 1883, Page 62, Entry 307
Source: Original register at Lancashire Archives


Death: 17 Sep 1882 Brownedge St Mary, Bamber Bridge, Lancashire, England
Gulielmus Waterhouse -
Burial: 21 Sep 1882
Age: 75
Abode: School Lane
Sacraments Administered: Yes
Buried by: Augustinus Firth Miss. Apos.
Register: Liber Defunctorum 1870 - 1894, Page 174, Entry 866
Source: Original register at Lancashire Archives


Death: 28 Mar 1878 Brownedge St Mary, Bamber Bridge, Lancashire, England
Elizabeth Waterhouse -
Burial: 31 Mar 1878
Age: 61
Abode: Bamber Bridge
Sacraments Administered: Yes
Buried by: Thomas Walker Miss. Apos.
Register: Liber Defunctorum 1870 - 1894, Page 112, Entry 557
Source: Original register at Lancashire Archives

http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Search/indexp.html


Lancashire Death indexes for the years: 1882

WATERHOUSE William 75 Walton-le-Dale Preston WLD/18/30


Lancashire Death indexes for the years: 1878

WATERHOUSE Elizabeth 61 Walton-le-Dale Preston WLD/16/44

http://www.lancashirebmd.org.uk/index.php

I've looked at the site again and think William died in 1882 aged 75 which would make him born 1807c Elizabeth died in 1878 aged 61 which would make her born 1817c. Both died in Walton le Dale.
Hope this is of help.
Pat

Have a look on the www.lancashirebmd.org.uk.
William Waterhouse married Elizabeth Leach in 1844.
Children seem to be Mary Ann born 1850 but died 1851, Isabella born 1844, Agnes born 1847, Joseph 1852 but died 1853 and Elizabeth born 1858. They were all born in Walton Le Dale, Preston, Lancashire.
Unfortunately the name Mary Ann Waterhouse seems to have been a common name at the time.
Pat

This seems to be Mary Ann and sister Elizabeth with Fox grandmother in 1861:

Elizabeth Waterhouse

in the 1861 England Census
Record Image View

View blank form

Name: Elizabeth Waterhouse
Age: 9
Estimated birth year: 1852
Relation: Granddaughter
Gender: Female
Where born: Blackburn, Lancashire, England
Civil Parish: Whittle le Woods
Ecclesiastical parish: Whittle le Woods
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

View image
Registration district: Chorley
Sub-registration district: Leyland
ED, institution, or vessel: 10
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 3
Piece: 3117
Folio: 26
Page Number: 1
Household Members:
Name Age
Elizabeth Fox 82
William Fox 36
Martha Fox 32
Mary Ann Waterhouse 13
Elizabeth Waterhouse 9

Thanks. Ellen Fox has cought my eye because someone in my tree has fox for a middle name which I thought was unusual. I'll try and find him now.

That's the family, Shirley, the family is at the bottom of the page and at the top of the next page is Mary Ann, 7 months old.

Siblings birth from the new search on GRO

WATERHOUSE, AGNES LEACH
GRO Reference: 1847 D Quarter in THE PRESTON UNION Volume 21 Page 623

WATERHOUSE, ISABELLA LEACH
GRO Reference: 1844 D Quarter in THE PRESTON UNION Volume 21 Page 647

WATERHOUSE, JOSEPH LEACH
GRO Reference: 1852 D Quarter in PRESTON Volume 08E Page 424

WATERHOUSE, ELIZABETH LEACH
GRO Reference: 1858 J Quarter in PRESTON Volume 08E Page 500

WATERHOUSE, JAMES LEACH
GRO Reference: 1863 M Quarter in PRESTON Volume 08E Page 515

WATERHOUSE, ISABELLA LEACH Order
GRO Reference: 1844 D Quarter in THE PRESTON UNION Volume 21 Page 647

WATERHOUSE, AGNES LEACH Order
GRO Reference: 1847 D Quarter in THE PRESTON UNION Volume 21 Page 623

???
1851 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Bamber Bridge Chorley Road, Walton Le Dale, Preston, Lancashire, England
William Waterhouse Head Married Male 26 1825 Engineer Lancashire, England Transcription
Elizabeth Waterhouse Wife Married Female 26 1825 House Keeper Lancashire, England Transcription
Isabella Waterhouse Daughter - Female 6 1845 Scholar Lancashire, England Transcription
Agnes Waterhouse Daughter - Female 3 1848 - Lancashire, England Transcription

Possible parent's marriage?

Marriages Jun 1844 (>99%)
Grice Jane Preston 21 516
LEACH Elizabeth Preston 21 516 <<<<<
Richardson James Preston 21 516
Waterhouse William Preston 21 516<<<<<

????

Marriages Jun 1844
Grice Jane Preston 21 516

LEACH Elizabeth Preston 21 516 >>>>>>

Richardson James Preston 21 516

Waterhouse William Preston 21. 516 >>>>>

???

1871 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Green, Clayton-Le-Woods, Chorley, Lancashire, England

Learn more

Print transcription View image Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Ellen Fox Head - Female 92 1779 - Lancashire, England Transcription
Wm Fox Son - Male 48 1823 - Lancashire, England Transcription
Mary Ann Waterhouse Granddaughter - Female 20 1851 - Lancashire, England Transcription
Elizth Waterhouse Granddaughter - Female 17 1854 - Lancashire, England Transcription

????

WATERHOUSE, MARY ANN LEACH Order
GRO Reference: 1850 S Quarter in THE PRESTON UNION Volume 21 Page 710

The previous page doesn't seem to exist
Even on FMP you can't go back a page .

She is on her own on the transcription

1851 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Chorley Road, Walton Le Dale, Preston, Lancashire, England


Mary Ann Waterhouse Daughter - Female 0. 1851. Born Lancashire

She seems to be 7 months old on the actual page


And she doesn't show on the later census

Hello
I'm looking at my relative in the 1851
Mary Ann Waterhouse born 1851 Lancashire.
She's right at the top of the page and says her relationship to the head is daugher but there is no option for me to go back a page please can you help.