Genealogy Chat

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The following is taken from TNA site: Seamen / women 1858-1913: The National Archives The Catalogue There was no central register of seamen. It may be possible to find something from crew lists or log books (BT 99), but we only have a 10% sample of those. Research guides Merchant Shipping: Crew Lists and Agreements, 1747-1860 Merchant Seamen: Agreements and Crew Lists after 1861 Maritime History Archive The rest are with the: Maritime History Archive Memorial University of Newfoundland St John's, Newfoundland Canada, A1C 5S7 The above dates are for a lot of people, and yes you may be lucky to be one of the 10%. Unfortunately there is a chance that most people like me are going to be equally unlucky being in the rest of the 90% category researching their mariner ancestors who are NOT in the Navy. Also found the following website below which states: http(://)www(.)crewlist(.)org(.)uk(/)findingoncrewlists(.)html (Remove brackets) Know the ship's name and official number? If you do know the basic information about the seafarer's vessel, the next step is to track down the crew lists for that ship. The lists are held at many different places: 10% are at local record offices (ROs) or archives 10% are at the National Maritime Museum (NMM), Greenwich 10% are at The National Archives (TNA (formerly PRO)), Kew 70% are at the Maritime History Archive (MHA) in Newfoundland I cannot say I have found Greenwich useful for the ordinary ship/boat but is very good for major ships and battles. Website below for Newfoundland Maritime Archives. http(://)www(.)mun(.)ca(/)mha(/)index(.)php Hope some of you have some success. Janet

Janet, It was a few years ago but I found that some of the mariners crew lists were at the Guildhall Library London. Worth checking for people who live in the area. The book of ' Records of Merchant Shipping and Seamen' by Kelvin Smith, Christopher T Watts, Michael J Watts is most excellent and gives all the listings and reference numbers. This is available at libraries. Margaret N

Margaret I was going to add the Guildhall Library to this list as they hold the Lloyds Lists of ships as well as Indentures for Watermen and Lightermen who are often known as 'Mariners' ,Sailors and Merchant Mariners. The terms are so loose and people who are researching their sea faring ancestors should be aware of the various ways they can be described. Not all of these men went to sea' in the accepted way that they sailed the oceans. They may have been fishermen sailing in coastal waters or deep sea fishermen, ferry operators or coastguard people. My own Merchant Mariner ran a ferry between Devon and Cornwall. Each person has to decide the exact area of seamen they are looking for and then go after the correct records. www(.)cityoflondon(.)gov(.)uk Having difficulty putting correct address for Guildhall Library so if you can't get it by the above address, then just google Guildhall Library for the information your require. I have been through the Lloyds Lists at the Guildhall Library and interesting they may be, but you need to have some knowledge of the name of the ship you are looking for as well as tonnage and ownership, but there is a lot of information there if you can find what you want. Sadly I found nothing on my ancestor. You can also write to Cardiff but to do that you will need the name of the ship/boat and when I enquired they wanted the tonnage and ownership of the boat. I felt like writing back to say if I had known all that I would not be seeking their help! There is also Southampton and Liverpool Archives to write for more information but these last 3 are very hit and miss as Southampton and Liverpool tend to deal with the Liners and other more prominent ships. Janet

My grandfather was in the Merchant Navy in Southampton during WWII, so I went to their Local studies library and found his, and his best mates discharge chitties. these were great, as not only did they have the ships they were on - they had photo's too!! I asked about my G & GG Grandfathers, who were also seamen, but not during the war - no luck there HOWEVER there were records of a few people,- including photo's- dating back to the 1890's. maggie

saving for reference

Janet, First let me say that Southampton Library has a really excellent section. While the docks were very large we had the Union Castle Line here and shared Cunard Line with Liverpool to name a few. It is always worth telephoning first as they only have records for the area and they are so helpful. Like you I did not find my ancestors at the Guildhall Library as one I did not have the name of the vessels and two my Gt Gr Fth was always known as Captain John (Wilburn) but I think that he was on local coasters between Kings Lynn and Hull mainly. I did however find him on a vessel in Poplar, London Docks on the 1901 census. That is as far as I have been able to go so far. Cheers, Margaret N

Margaret, It will be very easy to research those ancestors who were on the Queens and other important ships and this is where Southampton and yes Liverpool Archives come into their own. But like youself, there are many many people who have other seafaring people who did NOT serve on the 'monsters,' those like my grandfather who ran a ferry from Stonehouse in Plymouth to Cawsand in Cornwall and there were hundreds in fact thousands like him. My own Grandfather's records are not at Southampton, Cardiff, Greenwich, Plymouth Record Office, Guildhall Library or the National Archives although they were at the National Archives in 1992, but had a D beside the name when I went to research for the records in 1996. I was told this meant they had been destroyed. Many other people will find likewise, which is why I have highlighted Newfoundland for further search for those people who are unable to find their maritime ancestors in the UK. Maybe mine was sent to Newfoundland and not destroyed. I will certainly check when I have time because I know people who have researched through Newfoundland with great success when they have drawn complete blanks in the UK. All the places suggested so far, amount to 30% of Maritime Records and Newfoundland has the other 70%. Surely this is worth investigating! Janet

Janet, This seems to Maritime Weekend it must be the rain. Have you ever contacted Newfoundland? I think I did so many years ago with my 'Quill Pen' and that it was expensive and you needed to virtually provide the details for them to confirm and that was your lot. I decided not to go down that route in the end as like you I need somewhere that I can do the search for myself. Margaret N

Margaret Yes, its funny how you get a subject that repeats over a few days. I started this thread because I was concerned that people were being led to believe they would find their mariner ancestors easily at TNA and other places when the stark reality is that only 30% of these records are in the UK. As it had appeared before as a thread I wanted to make sure that people were aware of the Newfoundland 70%. The 70% is not my statistic! No, I have not yet gone down the route of applying to Newfoundland. However, I run a Family History Group and 2 members of my group have applied and got some wonderful information that they could not obtain at TNA, Greenwich, Liverpool or Southampton, so I have been toying with the idea. We are getting continual updates on one person's ' Grandad' which are really wonderrful and he is over the moon about the information he has obtained. When you reach a really sticky brickwall which nothing will shift it may just be worth the money to see if it can be shifted but even then there are no guarantees. This grandfather of mine is a real headache as I cannot find his marriage either, but I suspect a French marriage as my lot were in the habit of hopping over the channel to get married. I think that TNA shuffled off a lot of these records to Newfoundland back in the 1980's. The trouble is you cannot put a toe in the water and do the research yourself unless you go to Newfoundland so what do we do?? Most frustrating! Janet