Genealogy Chat

Gerry, think yourself lucky. There was a story in my local paper yesterday about a man who ordered something and the parcel arrived while he was away on holiday. When he got home, he found a note from the Royal Mail on his doormat saying they had put his parcel in his dustbin! Guess what, the dustbin had been emptied in the meantime! Kate.

Well Clare, I think you'd have to say from that reply, fair enough then! Personally I'm more interested in the info contained on the cert rather than the piece of paper itself - it's the info that I'm paying for, and the lower they can keep the price, the better. Sure, in an ideal world it would be nice to have pristine unfolded certs but if that means higher prices and longer turnaround times, then I'll put up with a few crumples! By the way, I order my certs online from Australia. They always arrive unfolded, in A4 envelopes, and seem to manage to get around the world without being too mangled! Richard

Here is my reply from the GRO - Dear Ms Smith Thank you for your e-mail. Due to the high volume of applications for certificates made to this office, processes are streamlined where possible in an attempt to ensure the turnaround time is kept to a minimum. Out of interest, as opposed to using the fact as an excuse in this regard, we are currently despatching in excess of 40,000+ certificates per week so I am sure you will appreciate the need to be as efficient and effective as possible to remain anywhere near our published turnaround times during this unprecedented exceptionally busy time. When one applies by post as you choose to, at the end of the process when the certificate is ready to be despatched, the bottom section of the application form housing the address label is perforated in order that the despatchers can simply tear off the portion and place it in the window of the corresponding size of envelope. Our address labels for postal applications fit into the small size window envelope which thus requires the certificate to be folded. Were we not to use these envelopes, we would not be able to use the tear off address portion of the form and every envelope would have to be handwritten. Sadly when we are under pressure to despatch 30,000 certificates per week, we are simply not resourced to handwrite that many envelopes. However, you are perfectly entitled to stipulate each time when making an order that you wish it to be sent out flat ie. in an A4 envelope to prevent folding and we will endeavour to oblige and honour your request. Alternatively if you continue to order from us by post, you may wish to include a cardboard backed envelope with your application for us to return your certificates in. Over half the applications received at this office are now received via our secure on line ordering site. Details can be found at http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/. Certificates ordered by this method are despatched flat in A4 window envelopes as opposed to the smaller window envelopes used for postal applications. The reason for the difference is due to the fact that we include a copy of the printed off application form with the certificate when despatching it to the customer as this allows the address (as the customer completed it on screen when placing their order) to appear in the window of the envelope. Again negating the need for staff to handwrite the address themselves which is time consuming and open to it being transposed incorrectly when speed is of the essence. Customers placing orders in person at the FRC have the choice of envelope size and they complete their address on it themselves when paying at the tills. We have had feedback from some on line ordering customers saying they do not wish their certificates to be sent out in A4 envelopes as they are more likely to be received crumpled than if they were simply folded. Similarly we receive comments from others who do not like the certificates being folded but we are simply unable to do anything other than the options we already provide. To send out all certificates in cardboard backed handwritten envelopes would increase costs which would have to be passed onto our customers and increase the turnaround time. From our annual Customer Survey results feedback I have no doubt that neither consequence would be welcomed by our customers. I hope this information assists. Yours sincerely Madeleine Brammah ------------------------------------------------------------

Helen That infuriates me. Sometime the postperson [let's be PC here lol] takes the mail out of his/her bag at the start of the road and then delivers it. That is OK on a nice day, but when it is raining, my mail is wet through before I get it. I tried complaining without success.

My certs have always arrived flat and only once was one slightly damp.

I must be quite lucky as I've not have that problem yet. My worst fear is that a stand-in postie will not use our outside mail box & just push the certs through the letter box. Our dog like to help & shreds anything that comes through the door! Geraldine

Where possible, you would do better to order your certs from the local RO - you can send them a suitable envelope with your order. The GRO is not geared up to dealing with individual requirements - it is an automated service which was designed to keep the cost DOWN to £7.00 per cert - it was £8.50 before this, when local ROs were only charging £7 - or in some cases, 6.50. OC

I think I might join you and email the GRO too, and tell them what awful condition the certificates are arriving in. When you pay £7 for one sheet of A4 paper (admittedly the work involved on their part too), I would rather it was given the respect it deserves. We pay £7 for each certificate, yet my last lot they shoved 4 in all together - I note they saved the postage costs rather than passing them on to me. It is a waste to post them all seperately, and they should say how many they can get in one envelope for a certain price and then send them all together in one stiffened envelope. Off to mail GRO

I just emailed the GRO complaints Department about this. Asked them if they could possibly give the person a choice of a stiffened envelope when they order a certificate at extra cost. Who knows if they will reply :)

I have had crumpled ones arrive, albeit slightly, but I had to iron them....try with medium hot iron, on wrong side, and with another sheet of clean white paper in between iron and certificate, they come up lovely!. However, we shouldn't really need to be ironing them, because they shouldn't arrive in such a state. If the GRO used better envelopes it would help. They waste money in my opinion. About 6 months ago I'd sent for around 6 or 8 certs at the same time, each one arrived in a separate envelope, yet all arrived on the same day. Now that's what I call a complete waste of money, envelopes and postage costs on their part!! OK, gripe over!! Karen

Reggie It's not just a metter of the size of your letterbox. An unprotected certificate in a flimsy envelope is very likely to be crumpled in the process of mail handling and delivery. The letterbox is just one step on the way. I would pay 50p extra for a decent envelope and a pristine certificate.

I don't have the problem.........my letterbox is wide enough to accommodate A4 envelopes. Reg

The fault lies with GRO, who are too tight fisted to use proper stiffened mailing envelopes, suitable for certificates (every stationer sells them). A cert. neatly folded in three in a normal DL envelope would arrive in better shape than a couple of flimsy sheets in an A4 envleope.

I know exactly how you feel. I hate mine coming through crumpled. I am lucky though as my postman is really nice so when i am due a certificate i let him know and he rings the door bell for that week with all of my post even if the certificate is not their. Could you not say something when you order the certificates and see if they would put a note on them for you. If not then i would have a word with the post office. Jen

Is it me just being fussy or does anyone else get narked when the postie folds certificates in half to cram them through the letterbox? :o( I like to keep mine nice and flat, but the last lot, that had four all in one envelope looked like the dog had chewed them (she doesn't ever touch the post). Having had the first lot bent up by the postie, I had a word with him when the next lot were due and told him what the envelopes looked like and could he please ring the bell and I would take them from him as they were important documents. He shoved the four in one envelope through, folding them and crumpling the ends :o( Two days later, I heard the door bell, went to the door to find another crumpled certificate on the floor and the postie on the step saying he hadn't seen the envelopes I'd described to him. I pointed to the crumpled heap on the mat and said they had all arrived now and that was the last of them, and picked it up and tried to straighten it out in front of him. Why can't the GRO put 'please do not bend' on the envelope? They may as well just fold them up and shove them in a smaller envelope to save on postage. Grrrrr!