Genealogy Chat

Am I right in thinking that the Mercantile Marine was the forerunner of the Merchant Navy & am I likely to be able to find any records if I don't have details of ships or the equivalent of a service number? From my gf's marriage cert (1923), I see that both he & ggf were in the Mercantile Marine & I'd like to know more about that aspect of their lives if I can. I wondered if gf was in WWI, he would have been 14 when war started though. Thank you. Geraldine

I tired googling mercantile marine and there is a lot but its hard to find out exactly what its about. This is an extract I found but it say 1929 and so dont understand how your ancestor would have been part of it in 1923? perhaps its something different? In 1929, it was decided to set up Mercantile Marine Departments and to divide the coast of India into districts based on major ports and to place each district in charge of Principal Officer. Accordingly, Mercantile Marine Departments were set up simultaneously in Calcutta, Rangoon, Madras, Karachi and Bombay. The main functions of the Mercantile Marine Departments include Administration of the various Merchant Shipping Laws and Rules relating to the Registration, tonnage measurement and crew accommodation of ships, surveys for Safety of Ships, Load line inspection, enquiries into shipping casualties and wrecks, holding of examinations for Certificates of Competency, survey of passenger ships, inspection and approval of statutory equipments vis-à-vis Life Saving and Fire Fighting, Appliances, communication equipment and other Navigational Aids, detention of overloaded and or unsafe ships, supervision of ship repairs and construction of new vessels at request of State and Central Government Agencies. Taken from this page: http://mmd.gov.in:7777/history.html Suzanne X P.S. you could try searching his name on the WW1 medal card index on the National Archives website.

Hi, I have a Mercentile Marine who died in World War One. This is what it says on the War Graves Commissions web site about the Tower Hill Memorial. In the First World War, the civilian navy's duty was to be the supply service of the Royal Navy, to transport troops and supplies to the armies, to transport raw materials to overseas munitions factories and munitions from those factories, to maintain, on a reduced scale, the ordinary import and export trade, to supply food to the home country and - in spite of greatly enlarged risks and responsibilities - to provide both personnel and ships to supplement the existing resources of the Royal Navy. Losses of vessels were high from the outset, but had peaked in 1917 when in January the German government announced the adoption of 'unrestricted submarine warfare'. The subsequent preventative measures introduced by the Ministry of Shipping - including the setting up of the convoy system where warships were used to escort merchant vessels - led to a decrease in losses but by the end of the war, 3,305 merchant ships had been lost with a total of 17,000 lives. In the Second World War, losses were again considerable in the early years, reaching a peak in 1942. The heaviest losses were suffered in the Atlantic, but convoys making their way to Russia around the North Cape, and those supplying Malta in the Mediterranean were also particularly vulnerable to attack. In all, 4,786 merchant ships were lost during the war with a total of 32,000 lives. More than one quarter of this total were lost in home waters. The First World War section of the Tower Hill Memorial commemorates almost 12, 000 Mercantile Marine casualties who have no grave but the sea. The memorial was designed by Sir Edwin Lutyens with sculpture by Sir William Reid-Dick. The Second World War extension, designed by Sir Edward Maufe, with sculpture by Charles Wheeler, bears almost 24,000 names.

Geraldine, yes, it is more or less the same as the Merchant Navy and probably not connected with that India stuff. I think that the term mercantile marine would have been used more in peace-time and merchant navy in wartime. Kate.

Thanks everyone. Any ideas on where I can go for info? I popped the names, one name really as son named after father, into the Documents Online part of the National Archives site but without success. Although that site does confuse me & I'm not really sure if I'm searching in the right way. I think it is because there is so much there. Is it easier to visit & spend the day there?

See if you can find anything through the links on this page. Remove brackets www.genuki(.)org(.)uk/big/MerchantMarine.html What is the name you are looking for? Julie

Thanks Julie. I'll go & have a look. Their names are William Henry Redman. My gf was born 1901 & his marriage cert shows his occupation as Cook (Mercantile Marine). His father of the same name is shown as Baker (Mercantile Marine). I think he was born 1879 - have yet to confirm. Geraldine

Heres a list of William Redman records I found on National archives. Registers of Seamen's Services Name Redman, William Henry Official Number: 218269 Place of Birth: West Wittering, Sussex 03 October 1885 Name Redman, William Official Number: 159572 Place of Birth: Gosport, Hampshire 03 September 1875 Name Redman, William Official Number: 139251 Place of Birth: Portsmouth, Hampshire 20 July 1867 Name Redman, William Henry Official Number: 134701 Place of Birth: Teignmouth, Devon 12 September 1870 Name Redman, William Official Number: 115061 Place of Birth: Ryde, Isle of Wight 20 June 1865 Name Redman, William Henry Official Number: 109439 Place of Birth: Saint Georges, Middlesex 23 July 1863 Name Redman, William Official Number: 101634 Place of Birth: Worthing, Sussex 04 June 1862 If you only type in Redman and not the full name you will get less results to have to scroll through.

Thanks Julie! The 2nd one down is looking a strong possibility. I just wish I knew what I was doing wrong when I do my searching. Thank you again. Geraldine

When you go to the documents online part of national archives if you click on the 'advanced search' you can do alot better searches adding place names and first and last names. If you use the quick search then it will search for anything with that name and if you search for the full name it will search for every William, every henry and every Redman. So if you use that quick search then its better to only put surname in. The advanced search much better though. If you are prity sure its him you can order the details for £3.50 and download them immediatly - no waiting. They normally give you details about their appearance, which ships served on with dates . I would want to be sure its him before getting it though. Hope this helps Julie