Genealogy Chat

Hi all just wanted to say a big thanks to you all for the amazing adice that you have given me. I hope that i come up with something! thanks again yvette

I've just been looking at Overleigh {Chester} cemetary records, over 6000 graves recorded, whilst going through the pages to get to my family names I found a grave for a stillborn baby from the 1930s. Maybe the parents were rich or something. I googgled and 2 different Cheshire Council records one only for specific name, the other allows you to go through all the names. There is also a site which tells the tale behind some of the deaths inluding Lily Langtrys' husband.

We have an office where you can register live or stillbirths before leaving hospital. With stillbirths, the registrar sometimes goes up to the ward or the parents come down, after consultation with the midwife over what's best in the individual circumstance. It can be very difficult for them to come to the birth reg office where there are parents in the queue with one or more healthy babies in tow. For neonatal births which have occurred in the hospital, we can do the birth and death registration one after the other (obviously both have to be done and in that order), which again is very traumatic. Being a registrar is a real maelstrom of emotions at times and that swapping backwards and forwards between happy and sad can be very wearing but nevertheless, it's very rewarding. Jack

Just found this: Stillbirth - registering A still-born child is legally defined as a child born after the 24th week of pregnancy who did not at any time after being born breathe or show any other signs of life. Note. - A child who breathed or showed other signs of life is considered live-born for registration purposes irrespective of the number of weeks duration of the pregnancy. When a child is still-born, the doctor or midwife who was present at the birth or examined the body will issue a medical certificate of still-birth. The person who registers the still-birth must take this certificate to the registrar's office. When to register a still-birth Every still-birth in England or Wales must be registered in the district in which it takes place, normally within 42 days. A still-birth may not be registered more than 3 months after it occurred. Information for the registration is given to the registrar by the person registering the still-birth. The information, is recorded in the still-birth register and the person registering the still-birth signs the record. Registration can sometimes be carried out at the hospital before the mother leaves, instead of at a registrar's office. The opening hours when a registrar will be available vary from one district to another and most of them operate an appointments system. You should contact the relevant district by telephone to obtain further information or to arrange an appointment. If it is inconvenient to go to the district where the still-birth took place, the information for the registration may be given to a registrar in another district. The registrar will record the details on a form of declaration and send it to the registrar for the district where the still-birth occurred. The registrar who receives the declaration will enter the information in the still-birth register. Certificates of the still-birth, which may be ordered and paid for at the time of making the declaration, as well as the document for the burial or cremation, will be posted by the registrar for the district where the still-birth took place. If a declaration is made, it may take a day or two longer for the document for burial or cremation to be issued. The family should discuss the arrangements with their funeral director and the registrar so as to avoid any delay to the funeral. What certificates will be issued? Certificate of registration A certificate of registration will be issued, free of charge, to the person who registers the still-birth. This certificate provides proof that the still-birth has been registered. Any names given to the still-born child and entered in the register will be recorded on the certificate of registration. Still-birth certificate After a still-birth has been registered, one or more certificates may be bought at the time of registration or at any time afterwards by the mother or the father. (The father's details would need to be recorded in the register entry for him to be able to obtain a certificate). Any application for a certificate from someone who is not the mother or father should be sent to the General Register Office, Anniversary Section, PO Box 2, Southport, PR8 2JD, giving full details of the purpose for which the certificate is required. Certificate for burial or cremation The registrar will issue a certificate for the burial (in a burial ground) or cremation (in a crematorium) of the still-born child. The certificate is normally passed to the funeral director who is making the arrangements. A funeral cannot take place until this certificate is given to the burial authority or the crematorium. If there is a delay to the registration, it is possible for a certificate for the burial (in a burial ground) to be issued before registration provided the still-birth does not need to be reported to the coroner. A certificate for cremation cannot be issued before the registration.

Thanks again for all your advice, maybe i should have a quick look through the death registers anyway, at least then i can rule them out.

Stillborn children are sometimes recorded in he burial register - there were some in the grave Robert Lindsey's infant aunt was buried in.

In the years in question, stillborn children were interred in coffins with other people. The chances of finding any records are minimal. My late sister in law had a stillborn daughter in the late 1930's..........her husband had to take the wee soul to the undertaker, where she was put in the coffin of his next 'client'........no records were kept. Reg

Maybe you could find a burial record, either in parish registers or in the nearest cemetery. Many places have their cemetery records on computer and will search a few years although it varies greatly as to what they charge or how helpful they are wiiling to be. Gwyn

thanks again for all your help. I am just trying to verify a story told by Gran (deceased) that she had stillborn twins. No one knows if this is indeed true or not, so i had the idea to have a look at the registers to see if anything was actually registered. So it would seem then that i cant just have a browse to find out, granny never gave names or dates or anything so bit stuck really, just wanted to clarify a family mystery. yvette

Due to the sensitive nature of stillbirth registrations, the procedure for ordering copy certificates differs from other types of certificates. Apart from very recent events, the General Register Office holds records of all stillbirths registered in England and Wales since 1 July 1927. Certified copies of these records can only be obtained with the registrar general's consent. The following conditions apply: a certificate will only be issued to the mother or father of a stillborn child siblings may apply if their mother and father are no longer alive. They should send details of their parents' dates of death with their application Stillbirth certificates can only be obtained from the General Register Office in Southport. If you want more information write: General Register Office, PO Box 2, Southport, Merseyside, PR8 2WJ or tel: (0151) 4714400. Alternatively you can visit the General Register Office website. The council is not responsible for the content or reliability of external websites. ( Btw - the actual register used by the registrar is not like the 300 entry hardback birth and death ones. The certificate issued at the time of registration is either a blue square one which is hand-written or blue A4 which is a complete computer-generated copy of the original entry. The latter costs £3.50.)

Only parents or siblings of the stillborn child can get certificates. More information here: www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/stillbirths/ nell

thanks to you both, so if there is a separate register i suppose i cant access it on the BMD that we can get on ancestry? or is there a way that i can see it? thanks for your advice yvette

There is a separate register for stillbirths. By definition, a stillborn baby has never lived (i.e. has not taken a single breath) so cannot have a birth registration and because its birth has not been registered, its death can't be either. Stillbirth reg started back in 1927 when the qualification was 28 weeks or later but that has come down to 24 because of medical advances. Jack

The baby *should be* on both. Sorry, I was wrong.

Hi all, would a stillborn baby in the 30's or 40's be on the birth or death register? having a blank half hour thanks yvette