Genealogy Chat

Hi, I am hoping someone can help with finding a relation of mine? Her name is Miriam Warley (married name Fox), working backwards I have her death cert, birth cert of her eldest son, and marriage cert, I have her in every census after her marriage but absolutely zilch before then! I have a possible birth for her on IGI but have not been able to confirm it with anything. Her death was 31.12.1895 in Middlesbrough, her marriage wa 16.10.1864 in Scarborough, and on all the census returns she has her place of birth as Wharram Yorkshire, Her marriage cert states her father as being John Warley - farmer. Ihave roughly placed her birth sometime between 1836 - 1838, this is from the ages that were given on her marriage cert(28) and her death cert (57). Sorry it's such a long winded one but any help would be gratefully received. Helen.

can you post the 1871 for ref please

Yes sorry not sure what else I should have put on! 1871 Middlesbrough 155 Stockton Street, William Fox age 33 - Bricklayer Miriam Fox age 33 Jeffrey W Fox age 4 Robert Fox age 2 Is that enough or is there anything else I need to pass on? Not that I have much more! Helen.

I cant even see that 1871 Do you have a number that starts RG ..../... page ...folio for it?

There is this one on the IGI: no father given though: MIRIAM WARLEY Christening: 11 OCT 1835 Wharram Le Street, Yorkshire, England Mother: HANNAH WARLEY Maybe she was illegitimate, and made up the father's name on her marriage cert?

sorry Jess - RG 10 / 4889 pg 24 Is that what you need?

There is a NK Warley on the 1841 (Not Known?) who is just 3 weeks old, Father is a shepherd called John: Edward Warley abt 1837 Surrey, England Epsom Surrey John Warley abt 1816 Surrey, England Epsom Surrey John Warley abt 1839 Surrey, England Epsom Surrey N K Warley abt 1841 Surrey, England Epsom Surrey Sarah Warley abt 1816 Surrey, England Epsom Surrey William Warley abt 1826 Surrey, England Epsom Surrey EDIT, wrong part of the country and the census says it's a boy, so probably wrong.

Richard Yes had thought of that one but still does not explain her non appearence on any census until she married! If that is her John is actually a family name, I believe that Hannah had a brother called John - think he was a blacksmith though! Thanks Helen.

Gill I'm sorry you have totally lost me there I haven't been at this very long - short sentances and words of one sylabl please! Lol! Sue Sorry she's fairly consistant with being born in Yorkshire, Thanks anyway. Helen.

just thinking around - miriiam is not a common name - wondering if she was raised with a stepfathers name. possibly her mother - only suppostion though Isaac Boyes 1842 Oct-Nov-Dec Malton Yorkshire - East Riding, Yorkshire - North Riding Elizabeth Bucklebath 1842 Oct-Nov-Dec Malton Yorkshire - East Riding, Yorkshire - North Riding Frances Chapman 1842 Oct-Nov-Dec Malton Yorkshire - East Riding, Yorkshire - North Riding >> Hannah Warley 1842 Oct-Nov-Dec Malton Yorkshire - East Riding, Yorkshire - North Riding

I don't know the place myself, but I don't suppose Wharram is a very big place? If you've been right through the baptism register between say 1830 and 1840, and if this is the only Miriam Warley, then I'd say she almost certainly will be the right one. If John was a family name, then it would seem a good one for her to pick for her father's name, even if she was making it up! If she was illegitimate, maybe she was adopted and therefore might appear on the 1841/51 census under her adoptive family name? Had a quick look and couldn't see anything obvious, but it is a possibility. There is this one in 1861 worthy of further investigation (living in Scarborough, where your Miriam got married): Name: Miriam Appleby Age: 24 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1837 Relation: Servant Gender: Female Where born: Wharram le Str, Yorkshire, England Civil parish: Scarborough Town: Scarborough County/Island: Yorkshire Country: England Your best bet, if you haven't already done so, would be to go through the film of the Wharram parish register. Incidentally, this one is the only Miriam Warley to come up on the IGI, for the entire British Isles between 1832-1842. Seems too much of a coincidence that this baptism took place in the very village that your Miriam consistently gave as her birthplace. Richard

The Miriam Appleby in 1861 is shown as unmarried. But there's no Miriam Appleby baptism in Wharram on the IGI, even though that parish seems to be covered on there. Richard

This family on the 1841 look interesting - father John Pickering, ag lab, wife Ann, have a daughter Miriam aged 5 (right age). And, they also have a son called ''Warley''! Ann Pickering abt 1795 Yorkshire, England Wharram le Street Yorkshire Ann Pickering abt 1831 Yorkshire, England Wharram le Street Yorkshire Elizabeth Pickering abt 1826 Yorkshire, England Wharram le Street Yorkshire Henry Pickering abt 1840 Yorkshire, England Wharram le Street Yorkshire John Pickering abt 1796 Yorkshire, England Wharram le Street Yorkshire John Pickering abt 1834 Yorkshire, England Wharram le Street Yorkshire >>>> Mirrim Pickering abt 1836 Yorkshire, England Wharram le Street Yorkshire Susannah Pickering abt 1836 Yorkshire, England Wharram le Street Yorkshire >>>> Warley Pickering abt 1829 Yorkshire, England Wharram le Street Yorkshire William Pickering abt 1835 Yorkshire, England Wharram le Street Yorkshire Source information: HO107/1212/14

.... and, in 1851 Miriam Pickering is living in Scarborough: Name: Miriam Pickering Age: 15 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1836 Relation: Servant Gender: Female Where born: Wharham, Yorkshire, England Civil parish: Scarborough Town: Scarborough County/Island: Yorkshire Country: England

And here's John & Ann's marriage. She WAS a Warley!! JOHN PICKERING Spouse: ANN WARLEY Marriage: 01 SEP 1817 Wharram Le Street, Yorkshire, England So maybe they ''adopted'' Miriam, the illegitimate daughter of Hannah, a relative of Ann? Richard

Yes, Ann & Hannah were sisters: ANN WARLEY Christening: 31 DEC 1799 Wharram Le Street, Yorkshire, England Father: JEFFERY WARLEY Mother: ANN HANNAH WARLEY Christening: 13 MAY 1813 Wharram Le Street, Yorkshire, England Father: JEFFERY WARLEY Mother: ANN So, Miriam was the niece of John & Ann. She appears as Miriam Pickering in 1841 and 1851, presumably because she was brought up by her uncle & aunt. I can't find her in 1861, though - maybe she was in fact the ''Miriam Appleby'' that I found (no idea why she would have used the surname Appleby though). Then she married under her true surname, Warley, but gave her adoptive dad's name at her marriage! Unless anyone's got any better ideas?

Richard You are and angel!! It seems very convoluted but everything does sort of fit together, I'd seen the Miriam Pickering and Miriam Appleby and wondered, but couldn't come up with a decent reason for the changes of name. Hadn't found the John and Ann link though! Many thanks to all who scratched heads on this for me - several are better than one!!! Helen.