Genealogy Chat

Thanks for your help guys, Curiouser and curiouser. William was a Labourer in a Gunpowder Factory in 1861! There is a reference to a death of William Close in 1865 at Barnsley. I will apply for the certificate. I also found Stephen's marriage to Elizabeth Wakes. This explains why Nan's middle name was Wake. I always wondered where that came from. But that certainly backs up my Nan's remembrance of a pub link with her mother.

So William & Elizabeth married in Barnsley in 1857. They are there in 1861 with Mary Ann, George and Elizabeth's mother. William is 30, and born in Winstone ,Co Durham. By 1871, Elizabeth is widowed, but still in Barnsley with her mother and George. There is a death for William Close in Barnsley in 1865. Mary Ann appears to be with her uncle in Co. Durham and Henry is in fact her cousin. Helen

HI Traced Stephen Close back as far as I could in the census and found this Living in Winston Durham James Close age abt 50 born in Cty Head Occ Labourer Ann Close age abt 50 born in Cty Stephen Close age abt 12 born in Cty William Close age 10 born in cty So this could tie in with the above Mary Ann Close being with her Aunt and Uncle on Father side. Wendy

HI to All of you I had a look in the 1871 and found this maybe ages were noted down wrong for the children by enumerator? Living at Kings Head Inn on Main Street Cornforth Stephen Close 42 Head nnkeeper Kings Head Elizabeth Close 43 Wife born transcribed as Sockburn Yorkshire Henry G Close 10 son born Shildon Mary A Close NIECE 3? born Barnsley mistranscribed as Barnedy Refs for above RG10; Piece: 4909; Folio: 26; Page: 17 I have saved the image if you want to take a look for yourself Wendy

According to the 1871 census Elizabeth Close is living in Barnsley with her mother Hannah Rushforth, and son George. Elizabeth is already widowed. No Mary Ann and no Henry. Elizabeth transcribed as 'Clore' Name: George Rushforth Age: 14 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1857 Relation: Son Mother's name: Elizabeth Gender: Male Where born: Barnsley, Yorkshire, England Civil Parish: Barnsley Ecclesiastical parish: St John Town: Barnsley County/Island: Yorkshire Country: England Street address: Occupation: Condition as to marriage: Disability: View image Registration district: Barnsley Sub-registration district: Barnsley ED, institution, or vessel: 21 Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 196 Household Members: Name Age Elizabeth Clore 38 George Rushforth 14 Hannah Rushforth 85 Source Citation: Class: RG10; Piece: 4647; Folio: 87; Page: 35; GSU roll: 848410. Helen

Have you tried the Historical Directories site? They have pubs - and Landlords'/Landladies' names. Christine

I've got one of these daughter (head) characters in my tree, and I think it means that one or both of their parents was the owner of the house but either didn't live there or was away, so the sons and daughters weren't quite sure who was the head of household. Kate.

I have hunted all over to find info about the pubs and licencees in 1881. I have some info on the Pubs, but not who was running them. ''Another legacy of the Ironworks was the 'Rosedale Hotel' built in 1870 and named after Rosedale in the Cleveland Hills where the mines provided the iron ore used by the Ironworks at Cornforth. The name of this public house changed to 'Ferry's' after the landlord. At the same time the 'Queen's Head,' 'King's Head' and 'Commercial Inn' were in existence, the latter was later named 'The Flintlock.' Later still came the 'Good Intent', but the date when this became a public house is not known. The Queen's Head, King's Head and Good Intent no longer exist.'' Having said that the 1881 only says High Street, so I only have gran's word that her mum once had a pub. It just seems so strange that Mary and Henry were at Cornforth while Widowed Mum and George were back at Barnsley.

Me again On the assumption that Churches and Pubs seem to be the last things to be demolished i have had a look at 1891 census for High Street Cornforth (i put the name of Smith in) on district 7a you will find Victoria Hotel and Kings Head. I know it doesnt prove anything but maybe it was one of these that Mary Ann was working in

On the 1881 image for Mary Ann Close it only describes her as 'daughter' and not head. She is 20 and has 'no profession'. Henry George is described as 'son' but his age is 12, so I asume he is her brother. At first I thought they belonged to the family who are also at the same address but in a separate household, as there seems to be a lot of children and stepchildren and the mother's name is Elizabeth - however she isn't old enough to be 'your Elizabeth' and you've already found her elsewhere on the 1881 census. Maybe Mary Ann just described herself as 'daughter' as she didn't like to call herself 'head' of household. Kath. x

Hi Think i understand what you are saying!! Have you tried looking at the main census pages on 1881, is the address of Mary Ann the pub, normally i have found they are shown as pubs with the name. What was the age of her Son? does it tie in with the brother or had she had a Son herself and named him after his Uncle? Maybe if her Mum owned the pub but she was running it for her she thought she ought to put down that she was the Head but that she was also the daughter of the owner.

Grampa Off the top of my head, I would imagine that she was the TEMPORARY head of the household (have you seen the image??) - maybe her mother was the Licensee but the daughter ran the pub? Licenses can often be found in Magistrates records - try A2A for a start, using the Pub name as a search. Otherwise it will be County Records I should imagine. (I didnt find licensing details of my Publican on A2A, but I DID find an Insurance Policy which he had taken out for the premises) OC

Mary Ann Close was born in Barnsley in 1861, daughter of William and Elizabeth (Rushforth) She had an older brother George Rushforth born in 1857. The parents married in December that year. Her younger brother Henry George (according to the 1881 Census) was born at Shildon, Durham about 1869. Father William had died before 1881, and the most likely reference would be for 1875 in Stockton on Tees. Now, here is the tricky bit. In the 1881 Census Mother Elizabeth is living in Barnsley as a widow with her son George Rushforth. Mary Ann is living at High Street, Cornforth, Durham listed as Daughter unmarried (Head) with Henry George listed as Son (Brother) I know that Mary Ann married Robert Heron in Sept 1881 from Long Row, Coxhoe. According to my Gran her mother once ran a Pub in the Collieries, and it belonged to her mother. Also that she once sang a Solo at Durham Cathedral. I have tried to find out something about Licencees in Cornforth, but with no success as yet. Questions: Why would she be down as Daughter (Head)? Where can I find info regarding Pub Landlords/ladies?

My Granny's Mum.