Genealogy Chat

As you say the similarities are so close, even the fact that John is listed as a Bricklayers Labourer in the 1881 census and a Bricklayer in the 1891 census. Another fact, which has just come to me, is the little girl Annie Madden. When Mary married William Burns her sister Annie was one of the witness’s to the marriage. So I am not going to discount the find, but all knowledge of the family does not point to a move away from Leeds once they settled in Leeds. But as I have found to my cost, never say never. Thanks for your help. Kind regards, Chris

Yes the bit about her place of birth bothered me too. However, it bothers me too that in 1881 we can find Maddens in Leeds - but not in London (with the London criteria) and in 1891 we can find the Maddens in London but not in Leeds (with the Leeds criteria).

Again Snonwdrop it all looks ok until you see that Anne is listed as born in London and not Ireland. We know from family history and photographs that John and Anne both came from Ireland. But also as we know depending on who gave the enumertor the information and whether he interpreted it correctly on the day is another matter. But the information is still worth keeping. Regards Chris

What about this off the 1891: Mary Madden Age: 10 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1881 Relation: Daughter Father's name: John Mother's name: Annie Gender: Female Where Born: Peckham, London, England Civil parish: Camberwell Ecclesiastical parish: St Andrew Town: Peckham County/Island: London Registration district: Camberwell Sub registration district: Peckham ED, institution, or vessel: 37 Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Name Age Annie Madden 34 born london Annie Madden 8 John Madden 55 born Ireland John Madden 6 Mary Madden 10 Thomas Madden 3 William Madden 1 It's an outside chance but worth considering? It's the ages between the mum and dad - big gap same as on the 1881 census.

Ah! the old Irish question. Unfortuatly I do not know anything about there Irish roots. It took my 10 months of looking through old Irish parish registers to find out which parish my Burns/ Byrne family came from in Queens county. Regards Chris

Ah well at least we know we have two John and Ann Maddens in Leeds marrying at about the same time. Do you know whereabouts in Ireland they are born - they could be listed under that in other census rather than just Ireland?

Thank you Snowdrops. But I know that Anne was called Farrell before she married John, based on Mary's birth certificate. Kind regards, Chris

I must admit I have seen this one Barbara and it is a possibility that as the young Elizabeth Mary is now 10 years old and living with relatives, but I have searched the death records not only on Free BMD but also at my local library and no John Madden nor Anne Madden deaths match the age criteria, so I do not think they died and the young Mary became ward to some other Madden relative. regards Chris

Christopher Have you looked on Yorkshire BMD. I can see their marriage on there and Ann's maiden name is Cullen - there are also a lot of other Madden's being born in the South East part of Leeds (which is where Mary's birth was registered). For reference its www.yorkshirebmd.org.uk Snowdrops

Sorry - just re-read your original post and that doesn't fit. Barbara

Would this be them in 1891? The older Patric Madden is listed as an 'excavator' and the younger one as a Police Sergeant. Living at 1 Chelmsford Terrace, Leeds. Anthony Madden 23 Catherine Madden 55 Edward B Madden 34 john Madden 20 Margaraet Madden 28 Mary Elizh Madden 10 Patrick Madden 58 Patrick Madden 26 RG12/3687 Folio 115 Page 18 Barbara

I am trying to trace a Madden family in Leeds but ancestry does not appear to be able to find them in Leeds nor anywhere else, yet I know they were living in Leeds at the time. In 1881 John and Anne Madden were living at 6 Wheeler Row RG11/4512 ED25 Folio 120 Page 10 There daughter Mary was born in May 1881 but the family even with wild cards cannot be found in 1891 and 1901. Mary however does re appear in 1901 when she marries William Burns at 1 Wrigglesworth Row RG13/4216 ED16 Folio 93 Page 12 Is there any thing I can do to find John and Anne that I am not doing already. Regards, Exasperated