Genealogy Chat

My Grandfather's Brother (Herbert Fish) married in 1916 to an older woman called Flora Crighton/Crichton (it varies). Having checked all the Birth Registers through the 1910's-1930's and finding no children I presumed they had none. They stayed married til 1961 when Herbert died & Flora reg'd the death. Yet when she died in 1973 the death was registered by an Archibald Crichton who is described as her son! Yet her Death Cert registers her under her married name of Flora Fish. If she had married before 1916 and had Archie first then why did he not have his Father's surname? I have checked the Birth Registers for the 1920s (Flora would have been 47 by 1930) again and can't find Archie Crichton/Crighton. Is it usual for a son to take his Mother's Maiden name, regardless of his Father? Malcolm Fish Dear all Just to let you know that I did trace and get the Birth Certificate for Archie Crichton in 1906 and as the Father's details are blank he may have been illegitimate. Obviously when his Mother married my relative later he/they decided he would keep the Crichton name and not take our Family Name. Having searched the Birth Registers beforehand and been convinced that this couple 'had no children', this has shown me that the Family Name or Line can continue, but in a less obvious way! Something to bear in mind perhaps..... Malcolm Fish

I would suggest she probably had Archie before she was married - i.e. prior to 1916, by another father. I would check indexes for the years before her marriage. Dea x

Could she not have been married before to a Crighton and Archie is his. She then married a Fish. Would make sense, her being the older woman, being married before. Gloria :-))))

Are you sure Crichton was her maiden name? If it was, maybe she didn't know who the father was so gave her name? Debby

he may well have been a) illegitimate - have you found his mothers birth b) mother may have been married before, and son a product of first marriage. what do you have other than the death cert in terms of certs? can you give us any geography on this tale please. some possibles, some obviously way too old! Archibald Crichton 1864 Oct-Nov-Dec Redruth Cornwall Archibald Crichton 1865 Oct-Nov-Dec Sunderland Durham, Tyne And Wear Archibald Crichton 1866 Oct-Nov-Dec Birkenhead Cheshire, Merseyside Archibald Eric Crichton 1906 Jul-Aug-Sep Croydon Surrey Archibald John Crichton 1896 Jan-Feb-Mar Woolwich Greater London, Kent, London

Aren't you more likley to be looking at a second marriage. Free BMD shows Crichton Archibald Eric born 1906. Why don't you get this birth certificate and see what is on it?

I would do as Michael says, get the birth certificate of the Archibald born Croydon district 1906. Flora's death was registered in that district, so is the obvious line to follow. Jennifer

Malcolm, Is this her birth? Name: Flora Jessie Crichton Year of Registration: 1883 Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar District: Toxteth Park County: Lancashire Volume: 8b Page: 271 Rose

She's in Cheshire in 1901. You might want to look for births up North too. Rose

Very occasionally - although if they were close enough to be registering the death, it seems unikely to apply in this case - sons have such a split with their fathers that they opt to use their mother's maiden name. Christine

Malcolm I see that you have added your feedback by amending your original message............it isn't readily apparent that you have responded when you do that. It is better to click on 'add reply'..........thus keeping postings in chronological order, and ensuring that the thread moves up the board. Reg

1901 - not sure really which one would be her-if indeed either of the are! Flora Jessie Crichton abt 1883 Liverpool, Lancashire, England Servant Liscard Cheshire Flora Crighton abt 1879 Birkenhead, Cheshire, England Servant Birkenhead Cheshire ------------------------------------------------ the first ones bap Flora Jessie Creichton Female Christening: 17 JUN 1883 Saint John'S, Liverpool, Lancashire, Burial: Parents: Father: John Creichton Family Mother: Jane and her sisters 2. Margaret Coatson Crichton - International Genealogical Index Gender: Female Christening: 02 DEC 1877 Saint John'S, Liverpool, Lancashire, England 3. Mirian Crichton - International Genealogical Index Gender: Female Christening: 20 JUN 1880 Saint John'S, Liverpool, Lancashire, England 4. Betsy Anne Crichton - International Genealogical Index Gender: Female Christening: 11 JUL 1875 Saint John'S, Liverpool, Lancashire, England

Dear All, Thanks for the advice. Flora Crichton/Crighton was her birth name in Toxteth, Liverpool (checked today at Family Records Centre) so can only presume that when she had Archie she was either unmarried or chose not to give him the Father's name. Thanks for the clue to 1906, he is obviously far older than I thought and I can get his Birth Cert when I go to the FRC next week. Obviously Herbert took on an older woman AND her son in 1916! Thanks again!

Hi Malcolm, You can look through births here because FreeBMD isn't complete yet and there could be others: http://www.ancestry.*co.uk/search/rectype/vital/freebmd/bmd.aspx Just remove the * Rose