Genealogy Chat

See below in a mo.....

In my tree I have no naming patterns at all, but am aware of this business of using the forenames of relations for the chidren. Now, is there any known pattern for using surnames as middle names? Here is my example: Father .....James Jamieson - I don't know who his parents are. Mother .....Jannet Joss - her father is John Joss and her mum's first name is Ann (surname unknown) So, you see....I don't know the surnames of either of the mums of the above. Now, these are the children of James Jamieson and Jannet nee Joss: Margaret Clark Jamieson b 1864 Barbara Tasker Jamieson b 1866 James Jamieson b 1868 John Joss Jamieson 1871 George Copland Jamieson b 1872 So the third child is named for his father and the fourth child for his mother. Does anyone know if the surnames Clark, Tasker and Copland are likely to be the maiden names of either of the grannies (plus one!) and if so, any guesses for the likely order? Merry

Merry All my scottish lot have their mothers maiden name as middle names. Not too sure on the structure of it (ie: 1st born son gets father's mother's maiden name - 1st born daughter gets mother's maiden name and so on) Should really examine mine properly to see the pattern for myself!! But it does exist. Perhaps someone else more knowledgeable can enlighten us? Snowdrops

I don't know if there is a pattern or not but both my in laws have surnames as middle names, father in laws grandmother was Small and my mother in law's grandmother was Henry, oops, maybe there is a pattern as they are both named after their grand mothers' although f-i-l is named after his mother's mother and m-i-l is named after her father's mother :-)) Tricia

Actually without getting all my records out, and just thinking about it, the first born son gets the mother's maiden name. Then various maiden names are given to later children - but still not sure in which order! Snowdrops

I lived in scotland a few years ago, several of my friends kids had their mothers maiden name as middle name Linda

I'm not sure about the pattern with surnames. I believe with 1st names it goes as follows. 1st boy is named after fathers father. 1st girl is named after fathers mother. 2nd boy is named after mothers father. 2nd girl is named after mothers mother. 3rd boy is named after father. 3rd girl is named after mother. Heather

Hi Merry, I know a lot of families in Scotland who have used the mothers fe maiden name as a middle name for her child. Betty

Hi My tree shows the same pattern as Heather's list for first names Also, it includes maiden names for mother and grandmothers in no particular order, just seem to make sure all names are carried on through the family for every generation! Have even got one maiden name that suddenly appeared after 3 generations! Linda

Hmmmm.....thanks for all your replies.....doesn't look too hopeful for my lot then? Merry

Merry and Heather, Are these patterns often used in places other than Scotland. My Scottish lot were happy with Isobell, Alexander and Jane. But my Huband lot from Devon have strange names. Merry, you told me Huband was not a common name in Devon, but it was definately their name. And the Hubands from other places don't want me. The children were William Scobell Huband, William Morgan Huband (William got reused after first one died) and Sarah Tracy Huband. William was the father, but Tracy in 1819 for a girl seemed odd and have no idea where the Morgan or Scobell came from. It's not the mother's maiden name. My illiterate Ketleys in Essex named their son Alma.

I would have thought Tracy was a surname being used as a middle name? Like boy Alma! LOL Merry

When I came across this Alma as the middle name of one of my partner's (male) ancestors, I assumed he was named after the battle, but I have never checked to see if it could be a surname. I'm sure Tracy would have been from a surname in those days. As for your Scottish rellies, Merry, I don't think there was a definite pattern for this middle name thing like there was for first names. But just to complicate things, some of my rellies were given surnames as middle names which were apparently not family names at all but from family friends, who I guess were probably their godparents, and perhaps likely to leave the godchildren money! The hours I have spent on those trying to find a family connection... Kate.

My grandad's middle name was the surname of his mother's maiden name. My gran's middle name was the surname of her dad's mum's maiden name. Their eldest child, my mum has a surname as a middle name which comes from my gran's side. My aunt, my mum's younger sister has a surname as a middle name which comes from my grandads side. One of my brothers has a surname as a middle name taken from my gran's side. But the rest of us? Whatever they fancied. Apparently I'm named after a waitress in Ireland that served my mum & dad on their honeymoon. But then my dad was English so the pattern's ruined anyway, lol.

Sons.... 1st after fathers father 2nd after mothers father 3rd after father himself. Daughters.... 1st after mothers mother 2nd after fathers mother 3rd after mother herself. Lets say John Smith (son of James Smith & Ann Robertson) married Margaret Paterson (daughter of Thomas Paterson & Isabella Finlay) Their children would be as follows.... 1st James Smith 2nd Thomas Paterson Smith 3rd John Smith 4th Isabella Finlay Smith 5th Ann Robertson Smith 6th Margaret Smith This is of course if they decided to follow the pattern and children were born in that order... alot of my ancestors did follow the pattern. On one occasion I found that the names were jumbled and that the 3rd son was named after his maternal Grandfather whilst the 1st was after paternal Grandad and 2nd after the father, I wondered why they left the name for the 3rd child but later discovered that they had infact named their 2nd son after his maternal grandfather but he died shortly after 3rd son was born so they used his name again for 4th son.

Hi Merry, My Irish line and my husband's paternal Scottish line both followed the first name conventions others have outlined -1st son=father's father, 2nd son= mother's father, 3rd son=father, 4th son=favourite brother/uncle etc. Reverse for females -1st daughter = mother's mother, 2nd daur. = father's mother, etc. However, no middle names at all. The pattern threw me out for ages, however, as two children died and their names were re- used further down the sibling line. For years, I thought I was looking for an Archibald MACKINLAY, when it was really a Peter MACKINLAY. HOWEVER, husband's maternal line, also Scottish, had : 1st daur =mother's mother name + maiden surnname, (Jane Anderson HOOKS 2nd daur = father's step-mother's name + maiden surname, (Sarah Boag HOOKS) 3rd daur= mother's name, no middle name(Margaret HOOKS) 4th daur= father's half-sister's name, no middle name,(Elizabeth HOOKS) 5th daur= mother's sister's name+ maiden name(Mary McCandlish HOOKS) 6th daur=father's father's 4th wife.(Agnes HOOKS) Sons -no middle names at all 1st son = father's father name 2nd son (dec.)= mother's father's name, 3rd son= father's half-brother's name, Make of that what you will - I found it confusing, as I didn't know for a long time that the father's father had been married four times. Regards, Beverley from Perth