Genealogy Chat

Hi, Have just received a death certificate for an Aunt who died aged 10 years, dated December 1921. The cause of death states, Spasmodic croup. with second cause of death as SINCOPE. Does anyone have any ideas what this means , Please. (Have googled this and only got foreign web sites.) Thanks, Joan

I think sincope is convoltions (fits) Sheila

Sincope should probably be syncope which means fainting. Spasmodic Croup: Coughing spasms with difficulty breathing. Also can mean severe laryngitis

Thanks for speedy reply. I did know about croup as my two boys had this. It was just the sincope that threw me. But fits/fainting would fit with temps etc. Thanks again. Joan

Syncope literally means fainting, but is often used on death certs (I have some myself) to mean "dropped down dead" which is not a cause, but an effect! I was discussing this with my mum the other day. All the earlier death certs I have are very brief and say syncope/flooding after childbirth/consumption etc. The later they are the more detailed they are and anything I have after 1970 has about 3 causes all with Latin names. nell

From the brilliant http://home*.clara*.net/dixons/Certificates/deaths*.htm "Cause Of Death In the early days of registration all the deaths were uncertified. The informant simply gave the cause as they saw it. And they were probably not far off the truth. You tend to get simple causes such as measles, stroke, gout, childbirth and so on. It is still possible to have a death not certified by a doctor in which case it is still the informant who is supposed to tell the registrar what the cause of death was. If you have a death certificate without the name of a certifiying doctor and it was not a post mortem or an inquest then you have an uncertified death. They are pretty rare today - but the sort of situation in which you would have an uncertified death would be where a person died at home at the weekend - they had only been treated by the one doctor from their surgery and that doctor went on holiday for a fortnight starting that weekend. In that case there is no other doctor who can legally sign a certificate. The coroner would then be notified - but if he decides after looking into the matter that there is no need for a post mortem then you would have an uncertified death. By 1845 most of the causes of death are followed by the word - certified. Where those words are not found then a doctor did not write a certificate of cause of death. Plenty of families who had sick and dying relatives would not necessarily have called a doctor to see the patient - after all doctors had to be paid. By 1875 the cause of death is followed by "Certified by..........(name of doctor) ..........(doctors qualifications)" in which case the doctor in attendance on the deceased in his last illness has signed a medical certificate of cause of death. This tends then to be in medical jargon eg myocardial infarction (a layman would have said heart attack) or cerebrovascular accident (stroke). A doctor is only qualified to sign if he has been in attendance on the deceased in his last illness AND has either seen the deceased within 14 days of his death or saw the deceased after death. If there is no doctor who qualifies under these restrictions then the death must be notified to the coroner. When a death has been notified to the coroner, that coroner may take one of two actions. If the coroner is satisfied with the cause of death and the circumstances immediately before the death, he may decide to take no further action in which case the original doctors certificate will stand."