Genealogy Chat

Sorry for the delay folks, my internet connection keeps playing up lately, I'm more off than on, thought I'd seen the back of all that when I left Talk Talk.

Kathleen, I had seen the John Arnoll one and by passed it but it is the right church so I'll check that one out Ann Marie Nowlyn seems a possibility I think the other one is a little too early.

Thank you everyone for your help.
Linda

Nothing on BVRI, Linda. Sorry.
Marg

There is this marriage on the IGI. I know the spelling of the name isn't the same but it comes up in a search for Arnold. Do you know if it's the same church? :-


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JOHN ARNOLL
Male


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Event(s):
Birth:
Christening:
Death:
Burial:


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Marriages:
Spouse: ANN MARIA NOWLYN Family
Marriage: 05 AUG 1822 Saint Leonards, Shoreditch, London, England

There is also this one, although maybe a bit early:-

JOHN ARNOLL
Male


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Event(s):
Birth:
Christening:
Death:
Burial:


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Marriages:
Spouse: MARTHA BENFIELD Family
Marriage: 21 JUL 1818 Saint Leonards, Shoreditch, London, England



Kath. x

Margaret: John Arnold 1802, thank you

How about giving us a name, Linda. I could see if there's a previous marriage on BVRI. Others might have other sources to check.
Marg

Jill - Too common plus I don't know the christian name.

Thanks Kath I'll try the phones on Monday.

Non-conformist is something like baptist, methodist etc. These records are separate from the parish (or Church of England) records.

If you can't get to the record office you could always phone or email them and ask if they have any of these records. They may do a look up for you - it all depends on who you get on the other end of the phone. Sometimes you get more help than other times.

Found this on Google:-

The Emergence of the Nonconformists.

The ‘Nonconformist conscience’ reflected the principles of a wide section of the community and influenced commercial, social, and political morality.

Henry VIII’s break from the Pope, which began the Reformation in 1537, allowed people to find their own forms of religion that satisfied their own needs and beliefs. To begin with the Reformation caused two major new religious groups to be formed. Puritans wanted to reform the practices of the Church of England from within the institution, whilst Separatists could see no way that change was going to occur without leaving and setting up on their own.

By 1567 congregations belonging to these nonconformists groups (also known as Dissenters) began to meet together in private for religious services. These ‘Independent’ units gave rise to the Congregational Churches, with the Baptists emerging later in 1603. The Presbyterians came into their own during the English Civil War. Presbyterians were part of the Church of England who had tried to modify the way that the Church was governed. In 1662 the Act of Uniformity was passed, which called for all ministers to swear by all that was written in the Common Book of Prayer according to the Church of England. All those who refused to comply were ousted from the Church of England. Presbyterians split further into two groups: Independents and Unitarians. In 1832 the Congregational Union joined together Presbyterians, Independents and Unitarians. In 1836 they began to set up their own churches.


Kath. x

Have you looked for possible death of first wife? How common is his surname?

Jill

What is a non conformist marriage? Would I have to go to the county to see the records or are they available elsewhere please?

Jill - He was born 1802 so there was time for a previous marriage, There is a son born 1826 but I've been unable to find a birth for him. On all census's he is shown as son to his father and the 2nd wife.

Have you looked for a non-conformist marriage? These should be separate from the parish records at the county record office.

Kath. x

No Peter I haven't looked at any other parishes, he was born in Shoreditch, 2nd marriage in Shoreditch 1827. Whole family so far is from the same area.

How old was he at the time of this marriage?

Would there have been time for him to have married and been widowed?

Are there any children with his surname who might have been his from a previous marriage?

Jill

That's my logic too Kathleen but I can't find anything prior to the marriage in 1827.

Linda,

Perhaps he was an incomer or married in another parish. Have you looked at other parishes?

Peter

I can't really see why a man would say he was a widower if he wasn't.

Kath. x

Parish marriage records 1827 state the male is a widower. Ican't find a previous marriage for him. Does anyone know is it a possibility he just said he was a widower and if so would this be a cover for anything i.e. like women pretended to be a widow if they had children out of wedlock?