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this is the family on 1881 census living at 14 Kent st London,Middlesex
Sarah Appleyard head widow age 48 born Stanton Wilts
Sarah Appleyard dau age 19 b Glos'ter st London
Rosina Appleyard dau age 17 " " "
John Appleyard son age 12 "" " "
Srah Appleyard is John Appleyard's widow
they married in 1860 Shoreditch.
Had help with looking but can't find them in 1861 or 1871....any ideas much appreciated!
Rosex
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JULIE have pmd you......you did a brilliant job! sorry!
Sorry Lynne, Julie has been very kindly helping me ,but no luck hence the "challenge"
have no idea what John Appleyard did for a job unfortunately so I am no use to anyone ! and think I will go and shoot myself! lol
Rosexx
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Getting no results searching on Findmypast for 1861 or 1871
Maureen
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Thanks for looking Glitterbaby, may remain a mystery!
Rosex
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Thanks for that LFW, will tell friend (whose family it is!) to get the cert' and see if that sheds a bit more light on
things!
Rosexx
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These ones are just awfully coincidental in 1871 ...
Name: Sarah Wilson
Age: 49
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1822
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: John
Gender: Female
Where born: Swindon, Wiltshire, England
Civil Parish: St Leonard Shoreditch
Ecclesiastical parish: St Augustine
County/Island: London
Country: England
Registration district: Shoreditch
Sub-registration district: Haggerston East
ED, institution, or vessel: 6
Household schedule number: 92
Household Members: Name Age
Jane Wilson 15
John Wilson 46
John Wilson 2
Mary Wilson 1
Rosina Wilson 4
Sarah Wilson 49
Sarah Wilson 8
Jane is a machinist, which Sarah is in 1881 ... and oh look. They're living at 3 Gloucester Street.
There's a William Wilson from Northamptonshire on the same page in 1881, for what that might be worth.
I dunno. Gloucester Street, same kids' names, same order of kids, Sarah born in Wiltshire -- doppelgangers, at the least.
Was Sarah living with Mr. Wilson as a couple, and they reported the children in his surname that year?
This can't be them in 1861 -- they're 10 years younger:
Name: Sarah Wilson
Age: 27
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1834
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: John
Gender: Female
Where born: Swindon, Wiltshire, England
Civil Parish: Shoreditch
Ecclesiastical parish: Haggerston St Mary
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England
Registration district: Shoreditch
Sub-registration district: Haggerstone East
ED, institution, or vessel: 5
Household schedule number: 107
Household Members: Name Age
James Wilson 5
John Wilson 26
Sarah Wilson 27
... well, except that they're living at 3 Gloucester Street.
What's the chance that John Appleyard + Sarah New marriage in 1860 is a complete red herring? Either that, or they split after having the children, or John died (don't see a death between John Jr.'s birth and the 1871), or the kids were Wilson's but had to be registered as Appleyard because they were born during the marriage. Any one seems quite a possible hypothesis.
It's pretty hard to tell whether the Rosina Wilsons in 1871, e.g., are all accounted for in 1881. It looks like that 1871 Rosina is a spare.
There seem to be some parallel Appleyards in Shoreditch. Three John births 1867-69, ... aha, John Henry and John Thomas, both 1867, died immediately, leaving John 1869. And he's nowhere to be seen in 1891.
I'm probably getting up into the realm of the known here, but this looks like Rosina in 1891:
Name: Rosina Hedley
Age: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1866
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: William
Gender: Female
Where born: Haggerston, London, England
Civil Parish: All Saints
Ecclesiastical parish: St Annes
County/Island: Northumberland
Country: England
Registration district: Newcastle Upon Tyne
Sub-registration district: All Saints
ED, institution, or vessel: 7
Household Members: Name Age
Ann Hedley 5
John I Hedley 1/12
Rosina Hedley 25
Rosina S S Hedley 9
William Hedley 34
William Hedley 7
Name: Rosina Appleyard + William Hedley?
Year of Registration: 1881
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
District: Bethnal Green
County: Greater London, London, Middlesex
Volume: 1c
Page: 575
Anyhow, that's my story, but I'm not necessarily sticking to it!
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Kathryn, that's fantastic. I spent a bit of time on this one & got nowhere.
Ozi.
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Hiya! I tell ya, after discovering the mystery of my gr-grfather, I'm game for considering any wild hypothesis about anybody's ancestors!
My gr-grfather Ernest Augustus Monck who emigrated to Canada with wife and kids after 1900 said he was born in 1852 and his father was Francis Monck and they were both cooks on ships. Well, no. Two years ago when I first discovered the online BMDs and censuses, I went looking for him. And were it not for search engines, I would never have found him.
No Ernest Augustus Monck was ever born, but an Ernest Augustus Hill was born in Dec 1851 in Cornwall ... right where, when I finally found my gr-grf in East Ham in 1901 (as "Morick"), he reported being born.
My Ernest's first (I thought) daughter Ada died in infancy, and it turned out she was Ada Lennox Monck. Lo, there was an Ada Lennox Monck marrying 10 years earlier. And behold, Ernest Augustus Hill had a sister named Ada LM Hill -- who turned out, I learned from christening records found by a kind acquaintance (and you can't imagine how gobsmacked I was to find the proof of my wild theory) and the GRO when FreeBMD finally got 1854 transcribed last spring, to be Ada Lennox Monck Hill. Oh, and they had a father (at least in name) called Francis Hill. And no Francis Monck ever lived.
From those two coincidences -- a Hill where there should have been a Monck, and a Hill sibling named Monck -- came my whole construct of my grandfather's family, about which I am beyond a doubt certain now. I keep finding little things (or in this case, kind strangers find them for me) like how father Francis had a mining lease in Cornwall in partnership with someone who emigrated to Australia shortly after, whose son (before becoming a prominent politician) manufactured farm machinery there ... which could just explain why Francis's son, my gr-grf, emigrated to Australia in the 1880s and is described on his son's birth certificate there as a "Case dealer". Cases of what? I'd thought, not thinking it likely that my gr-grf was selling farm machinery. Option 2 now actually seems rather likely indeed!
Sometimes fact is stranger than fiction, so I never hesitate to come up with wild theories and test 'em out ... although sometimes I do manage to come up with complete fiction nonetheless. ;)
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Kathryn will pm you but thanks for all this , you are right about Rosina and William Hedley (my friend's gt grandparents so I know that bit is definitely right! ) Will read through all this and see if I can find whether John Wilson and John Appleyard are one and the same or whether there were 2 marriages and the children (who are right names and ages) changed names!
Rosex
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Hey Rose! (Yes, it's me ;)
I was just looking back at the very first pages of my existence here at GR in My Threads, looking for something else -- and I saw this with your name on it. On my very first page of TTF posts. (I'd signed on to the site 2 years earlier, but was one of the ones who had never clicked on Community.)
I didn't know who you were, and of course you didn't know who I was. And I'd certainly never heard of Annie Murrell at the time ... ;)
And here I blathered on about Ernest Hill/Monck for probably the first time, too.
So how did this pan out??
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