General Chat

What I do object to is that Scots MP's and Welsh MP's not forgetting N. Ireland can all sit in the Palace of Westminster and vote on issues appertaining only to England yet our English MPs cannot (as far as I am aware) go and sit and vote in any of the other UK Parliaments.

For the record Mary Queen of Scots (Dec 8th 1542-8thFeb 1587) was the daughter of James Vth of Scotland and his second wife Marie of Guise who was the eldest daughter of Claude of Lorraine Duke of Guise, and his wife Antoinette de Bourbon introducing a french connection long before Charles 1st and Henrietta Maria . Mary married Henry Lord Darnley and they were the parents of James V1th of Scotland/1st of England. Mary's grandmother Margaret Tudor was the sister of Henry V111th and married James1Vth of Scotland , he was killed at the battle of Flodden Field in 1513 leaving his son aged 1 to inherit the Scottish throne. I think Mary was a very tenuous Tudor!

Oh, I have a balanced view alright. One that is my own, aided by the big picture and not the words of politicians and state controlled media :-)

Typos I assure you :-D :-D

Sorry, Eldrick, I got your name wrong. Is that why you got mine and Alex Salmond's wrong?

If you follow the Stewart line back, you will find that it originated in Brittany.

And by the way, I am not Scottish either but I live there and as you are in Northumberland, you should be able to receive Radio Scotland and possibly even BBC Scotland. Listening or watching them might help you to get a more balanced view of what the SNP are saying.

Proddy M'dear

I dont see any mention of Brittany there, which was your originalk assertion. 'Tis not I that needs the history lesson :-)

And if you believe that Salmond would be content to leave the Queen as head of state, then fair enough. I don't, othewrwise why would he be so hell bent on independance?

PP...I dont think I like that comment.

'sweaties coming down here have a passport and their jabs!!!!'


Marion ( whos not sweaty and yes i've had my jags)

Eldrig,

I think you need to get your history books out. the Stuart line goes back a lot further than Charles the 1st! This was the first Stuart or Stewart King of Scotland:

King Robert II of Scotland
Father: Walter Stewart
Mother: Marjorie daughter of Robert Bruce
Relation to Elizabeth II: 17th great-grandfather
House of: Stewart
Born: March 2, 1316 at Paisley
Ascended to the throne: February 22, 1371 aged 54 years
Crowned: March 26, 1371 at Scone Abbey, Perthshire
Married:(1) Elizabeth Mure, 1336
Married:(2) Euphemia of Moray, 1355
Children: 10 by Elizabeth Mure including John (Robert III), 4 by Euphemia and several illegitimate.
Died: April 19, 1390, at Dundonald Castle, Ayrshire, aged 74 years, 1 month, and 17 days
Buried at: Scone Abbey
Succeeded by: his son John who took the name Robert III

Robert was a grandson of Robert Bruce, and the first in the House of Stewart dynasty. The name came from his ancestor Walter Stewart who was appointed High Steward of Scotland by David I. He had escaped following the defeat of David II at Halidon Hill in 1333 and took over as Guardian of Scotland while David was in exile in France.

From this site:
http://www.britroyals.com/scots.asp?id=robert2

Mary Queen of Scots was also a Stewart, the daughter of James V of Scotland. Her grandmother was a Tudor, daughter of Henry VII of England.

Alex Salmond has stated that the Queen will remain the Queen of Scotland.

Don't believe you Eldrick...bet you're a secret whiskey drinker too :-D :-D :-D :-D

How many more times! Hadrians wall is not the Scottish Border! Theres nearly another 100 miles to go up the east coast! It's an enduring popular myth that the wall was built to keep the Scots at bay. It wasn't.

Its amazing how many people think Newcastle is in Jockland and that we in Northumberland all speak fluent Jockanese. I hereby declare that I am not Scottish, don't want to be and distance myself from any claim for republicanism from either side of the REAL border :-D :-D

Eldrick you do make me smile :-D

Poddy

How do you know that Scotland would be part of the commonwealth? All the other countries in the commonwealth were colonised by the UK as a whole -- the union of teh crowns was an agreement to end years of cross border strife. They had their own monarchy before the Union, so if they want to revert back to being an independant nation, then they will have to decide on a new constitution and whether to have a president or a monarch, presumably. Do you really think Alex Haddock will accept the Queen as his head of state? I don't. I bet he would love to put a crown on his own head though!

As for the Stuarts, Charles 1st was the son of James 1st and VI of Scotland, who in turn was the son of Mary Queen of Scots, who was a Tudor. I don't think there was any French blood in the original dynasty, although taking onto consideration the incestuous nature of the European royal families it would be of no surprise. The Fench connection came later with the marriage of Charles 1st to the Roman Catholic Henrietta Maria in France in 1625.

Think that is about right, Muffy.

Eldrig, the Queen would remain Queen of Scotland and Scotland would remain in the Commonwealth and I think that the Stuart dynasty originated in Brittany. Wasn't Bonnie Price Charlie quite a little man, rather like Nicolas Sarkozy?

Sorry Potty, I meant what you have just said. I was in full steam, and got abit confused. Sorry, I did not mean to confuse.

Julia in Derbshire

Potty am I right in thinking that polls put it somewhere like a third supporting independence? x

Julia, there is no "proposed handover in 2014". 2014 is the SNP's proposed date for a referendum in Scotland, which was part of their manifesto in the last election for the Scottish Parliament. David Cameron is saying that the UK government has to give "permission" for any referendum to take place and to say what the questions should be or it won't be legally binding.

I think public opinion here in Scotland is divided at the moment, but if DC keeps telling the Scots what to do it may well back-fire and persuade more to vote for independance than might otherwise be the case.

Ann,Also that they would be clammering for the one he promised us on the EU..A for the Scots, If they want out, so be it, but it would have to be completely,not partially.**M**.

I think I read that David Cameron doesn't want the referendum to be in England because of the fact that a lot of English would like to vote Scotland 'out'.

I agree Teresa...although an opinion poll I saw last night showed far more English were in favour of Scotland leaving the union than Scots lol x

Before reading the rest of the thread, in part I do agree, if Scotland wants independence, then surely they have the right to have it, as do Wales and Northern Ireland (though the complications from that don't bear thinking about). There definitely should be a referendum, but that referendum should not just be in Scotland. Scottish independence will have an enormous impact on England and the rest of the UK too, both good and bad, so that referendum should come from Westminster rather than the Scottish Parliament, and include all UK countries.

Personally, I would prefer to see a UNITED kingdom, and not a fragmented island.