General Chat

Oh yes, Merlin, we have been 'victims' of that one :-0

Perhaps the sencond part of the post was "Wrongly Worded" and not meant as it appeared to be taken. However, What about the many people who paid into Private Pensions for their retirement and then got ripped off by Gordon Brown &Co? :-(

I'll keep you posted on that one :-D :-D

I don't think you can ever devise a completely 'fair' system. For a number of years I paid a 'married woman's' stamp believing that it would contribute to a state pension, which of course I later discovered that it did not! Obviously I felt miffed at that BUT, perhaps I should have been more on the ball in the first place! I'm 'on the fence' about winter fuel allowance etc., because presumably wealthy pensioners while receiving these benefits lose them again through taxation, so, swings and roundabouts there. How long you draw your pension is of course in the lap of the gods, I knew an old lady who has just recently died aged 103!! not only her OAP was paid all those years but also a Post Office pension taken out by her husband way back when?!!! Perhaps the former part of that will be you AnnCardiff?!!!!

Too many people see the world in black and white, and I am not talking colour of our skins here. My partner is the same, he can't see that there are always grey areas where different rules or situations apply.

My brother and s.i.l. never had children by choice, nor did her younger brother so never needed Child Benefit or anything else like that. My brother worked and did well and paid a lot of tax, and his wife worked too. Some people have a hoard of children and do or don't work, but get lots of Child Benefit etc so that is an unbalance of things too.

It's all swings and roundabouts, and always will be. I think there are new rules for State Pension now where the criteria of working or paying a stamp for so long, has changed. Women used to lose out if they stayed home to bring up children and that meant they didn't always get the full pension I believe. Now I think that has changed too.

No one can state categorically that certain people worked for their pensions and others didn't work so shouldn't be entitled to Benefits.

Lizx

So somebody who has worked for 25 years at top rate tax and NI, and who is made redundant and has to claim job seekers or similar, hasn't paid 'as much' as some pensioners? Every case is individual and you can't just lump 'benefits and welfare' together in sweeping statements.

I intend living for ever to get his money too!!!! :-D

No what Barry says isn't rubbish. 'TECHNICALLY' however it is funded, you don't get the state pension unless you satisfy the conditions of having contributed enough money through working and paying NIC for enough tax years. The words 'National Insurance' are the clue.........like any insurance, if you don't pay in you can't claim. It was never completely funded by the NIC contributions an individual made, so I don't know why there is such a hoo-ha being made these days that the current generation is funding it. It was always so, but not completely. Tax as well as NIC funds it, including the tax that companies and a large proportion of pensioners are paying right now!

Welfare benefits that I think Barry means are the NON CONTRIBUTORY ones ie you can get them whether or not you have have made any payments of tax or NIC at all. These are usually claimed when people either haven't paid any or enough NIC to qualify for or are to top up a contributory benefit like a state pension that is paid at a lower rate because less NIC was paid.

I wouldn't dispute that some payments will have been made by many individuals who have worked but, however you look at it, people in the latter group have paid in less than the first group, so Barry has a point.

That is always sad AnnC, it happened to my neighbour too and seems so unfair that some neither get the years of retirement nor the rewards from what they pay in.

Yes AnnCardiff and in my humble opinion you should be entitled to claim that which he didn't have a chance to.

and then there's my husband, who worked all his life and died shortly after reaching pension age so never claimed much of what he paid in - swings and roundabouts

That's what I mean, they have worked and paid into the system and it is those that don't get the help they need, and he is making the assumption that " the second didn't "
Best wishes to you Joan and your hubby.

With respect Amokavid as much as he may want to work, would a company take him on at that age and being ill.
Please understand I am not being nasty nor judging, but it seems if you do the right thing, pay all your dues you get no help what so ever when the government should help those that helped themselves.

Many people who are entitled to benefits do or have worked. They may be in low paid jobs or have lost a job through no fault of their own.

How can they run out of money and send billions abroad in aid ?

Well technically, the current generation of pensioners 'worked' to pay their own parents pensions.

Its us and our children (or their generation) who are supposed to be working to pay for the current OAPs.

Unfortunately, as much as it may gall, the tax and NI being taken from those working has to be spread even further than it has in the past.

Hmmmm good question.

We are always hearing about how OLD AGE PENSION is going to run out of money.

How come we never hear about Welfare / Benefits running out of money?

What's interesting, the first group "worked for" their money... the second didn't!!