General Chat

After researching one family, I hold all the birth records for children born to one couple.
They had 4 sons in total and so far, I have obtained the death certs for just 3 of them.

The 3rd death is dated 1952 and the corresponding obituary that I have, states that this man was the "last surviving son born to his parents"

Trying to locate a death record for the youngest, missing son......
He was in the Royal Navy and the last sighting of him that I can find was in 1939.
( I assumed he died between 1939 and 1952)
Then I found this?

His DOB and parents are correct (although the father was called Otto rather than Oswald)

U.S., Social Security Applications and Claims Index, 1936-2007
William Smith Elfert
Gender: Male
Race: White
Birth Date: 6 Oct 1893
Birth Place: United Kingdom
Father Name: Oswald Elfert
Mother Name: Amy Smith
Type of Claim: Original SSN.
Notes: 02 Nov 1983: Name listed as WILLIAM SMITH ELFERT

Can anyone tell me what this is?
I understood this was an original application for a SSN, but this man would be 90yrs old in 1983.
Based on his brother's obituary, his surviving family thought he was already dead by 1952 ??

You probably know all about his trips ...... but this one interested me when I saw it on ancestry on Outgoing Passenger List

This is his arrival in the US ...... note his year and place of birth ......

Ship Manifest

FIRST NAME
William
LAST NAME
Elfert
Marital Status
Unknown
GENDER
Unknown
Age at Arrival
38
Ethnicity
N/A
Place of Birth
N Y <<<<<<<<<<<
Year of Birth
1917 <<<<<<<<<<<
Passenger ID
9012025474622
Date of Arrival
January 1st, 1955
Ship of Travel
Liberte
Port of Departure
N/A


He was travelling with a Frances Elfert


FIRST NAME
Frances
LAST NAME
Elfert
Marital Status
Unknown
GENDER
Unknown
Age at Arrival
32
Ethnicity
N/A
Place of Birth
N Y
Year of Birth
1923
Passenger ID
9012024044196
Date of Arrival
January 1st, 1955
Ship of Travel
Liberte
Port of Departure
N/A


Could he be a child of William Smith???

possibly not, he might be the son of Abraham and Sadie

I can't explain what you found, except that he could have cut himself off from his family, for whatever reason

I found this on ancestry ............


UK, WWII Medals Issued to Merchant Seamen, 1939-1945

Name: William Smith Elfert
Birth Date: 6 Oct 1893
Service: 1939-1945
Medal Issued/Claimed: 1946-2002
Discharge Number: 1046447
URL:

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D4295473

William S. Elfert
New York Passenger Arrival Lists (Ellis Island)
Given Name William S.
Surname Elfert
Event Date 22 Sep 1922
Age 28y
Nationality British, Scotch
Departure Port Port Antonio, Jamaica
Arrival Port New York, New York
Gender Male
Ship Name Princess May
-------------------------------------------------------------

William Elfert
New York Passenger Arrival Lists (Ellis Island)
Given Name William
Surname Elfert
Event Date 22 Nov 1924
Age 30y
Nationality G.B., Scot
Departure Port Liverpool
Arrival Port NY
Gender Male
Ship Name Chickasaw City.

-------------------------------------------------------

William Elfert
New York Passenger Arrival Lists (Ellis Island)
Given Name William
Surname Elfert
Event Date 29 Apr 1923
Age 29y
Nationality British, Scotch
Departure Port Curacao, DWI
Arrival Port New York
Gender Male
Ship Name Caracas.

seems he was in and out of NY.
---------------------------------------------
and again,!

William Smith Elfert
New York Passenger Arrival Lists (Ellis Island)
Given Name William Smith
Surname Elfert
Last Place of Residence Glasgow, Scotland
Event Date 07 Aug 1922
Age 28y
Nationality Britain-Scotch
Departure Port Glasgow
Arrival Port New York
Gender Male
Marital Status S
Ship Name Assyria

Maybe he worked for one of the liners,White Star or Cunnard.?
Could the date 1983 be just when this came through the system for archiving.?
Edit,====
All the named ships can be found Wikipedia and were cargo drop and reload for another port.

Thanks for you input Sylvia and Kay.

I know that the 1955 travel with William and son Francis is not the missing man.
I can find them on US census data and discount them.

I should also have said that although this man had 3 brothers, he also had a number of sisters, one of which registered the 1952 death.
I assume that she/and or her surviving sisters placed the corresponding obituary and funeral announcement.

His brother who died in Canada in 1949 was also in the Royal and Merchant Navy, and the wider maternal line were steeped in naval history.

I think it's probable that his SSN application date of 1983 was an archive date.

I also wondered about this:

me: William S Elfert
Birth Date: abt 1894
Date of Registration: Jun 1966
Age at Death: 72
Registration district: Liverpool North
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 10d
Page: 221

This is possible as his maternal relatives ( also naval) lived/died in Liverpool.
A 1966 death still doesn't explain it though!

William Elfert
United States Census, 1940
Name William Elfert
Event Type Census
Event Date 1940
Event Place Assembly District 18, Brooklyn, New York City, Kings, New York, United States
Gender Male
Age 23
Marital Status Single
Race (Original) White
Race White
Relationship to Head of Household (Original) Son
Relationship to Head of Household Son
Birthplace New York
Birth Year (Estimated) 1917
Last Place of Residence Same House
HOUSEHOLD

ROLE

GENDER

AGE

BIRTHPLACE

Abraham Elfert Head M 44 Russia
Sadie Elfert Wife F 46 Poland
William Elfert Son M 23 New York
Sam Elfert Son M 21 New York
CITING THIS RECORD,
This is the above that Sylvia posted..bn 1917.


There doesnt seem to be a reg birth for William that I can see,

I supose you have this.

William Smith Elfert
United Kingdom, Merchant Navy Seamen Records
Name William Smith Elfert
Event Type Military Service
Event Year Range 1918-1921
Event Place United Kingdom
Birthplace Aberdeenshire
Birth Year 1893

Thanks Kay,
Yes, I do have the Merchant Seaman Record .
William S Elfert was born in Aberdeen and his family later moved to Glasgow.
The correct address appears on some of his travel docs.

The family in NY have no connection.
Father Abraham born in Russia?
William's father was born in Germany and was naturalised in Aberdeen


William first travelled to the US in 1922.
He gave his parents home address and that of a known relative in NY.

The last positive sighting is 1939 when on arrival, he claims legal admission citing the same 1922 travel details

I think we are on the right lines that 1983 must be the archived date or one in that it came into the public domain?

I was intrigued by the Medals Issued to Merchant Seamen because of the date issued/claimed information ..........


UK, WWII Medals Issued to Merchant Seamen, 1939-1945

Name: William Smith Elfert
Birth Date: 6 Oct 1893
Service: 1939-1945
Medal Issued/Claimed: 1946-2002 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Discharge Number: 1046447
URL:


If that is so, then it is an indication that he was alive after 1939.


I have to say that I had posted last night most of the US entries that Kay has posted, but then decided that you must have them, and so I deleted my postings :-(