General Chat

My 2nd cousin is a shepherd in the Lake District. He is darn quick shearing a sheep and an ace with his dogs. He has no time at all for T May and her cronies.

Yes, I have had a go at shearing sheep. It is not that difficult if you have lots of time and the sheep is cooperative. Sadly time is short and so is the patience of sheep :-(

The G uncle of my mother established a substantial sheep farm in Yorkshire N Riding which is still in business today. Sadly he died of a sheep shearing disease when he was only 40.

ok?

Pound spikes above $1.33 as IMF admits financial market turmoil triggered by shock Brexit vote has subsided

UK factories bounce back from Brexit shock

Siemens promises UK investment despite Brexit warning

UK sees record number of foreign investment projects

Yep sure is a disaster! lolol

See this is where I should RR Rollo..no need to call me a fool dear boy

As always we can agree to disagree because I don't think we'd ever totally agree on anything Rollo but I will not call you childish names......

My grandfather was a shepherd but I would be utter rubbish in a lambing yard, wouldn't even know how to build one. Just saying.

my rellie is a totally norm,al person who worked very, very hard - and still doies

you (Caroline) are a fool, more than that I have no time to say

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/sep/02/theresa-may-bleak-future-outside-single-market-eu-trade

Oh here we go again Rollo......I am sticking to facts. Not quite sure why you used Steptoe as your example........as I said earlier you can find whatever you want if you go looking for it.....my example of drunk driving is the best example.
As for your relative being the asst chief constable...are any of your relatives "normal common folk"...anyway I think this is just another example of those at the top not knowing what is going on in the real world ...talk to those that actually go out into the real world and follow the instructions from those at top eg lets find drunk drivers this week....let's label everything we can as a hate crime.....this is along the lines of very young children being reported for sex crimes when all they did was kiss another very young child on the cheek.
As with everything around Brexit we can agree to disagree about this....but I'm guessing someone will "attack" this comment again !!

One of my rellies is an assistant Chief Constable of police and ihas access to the latest records which show that all kinds of hate crime are up sharply since June 24. The sort of campaign created by Farage and co has created space for these sorts of people to push the envelope further than they otherwise might have done.

Reported crime tends to run well below what is actually happening on the street.
There are various reasons for this.
(a) the police are seen as don't care/do nothing - the truth is that under the treasury cosh they don't have the resources and have to focus on the more serious stuff even if it wuld be better to show the badge earlier; community police have been cut right back
(b) those attacked fear retaliation on themselves / family / property - my OH reported abuse, spitting etc and was rewarded with hundreds of pounds of damage to her car for instance

Although the post brexit climate has created a very poor space in some parts of the country the hatred itself is probably not brexit linked for the most part i.e. idiots feel they can do so they do and the victims are the old, women, disabled as well as foreigners though using a foreign language is for sure a trigger.

Nonetheless current events both on the street and in the nation's politics are having a numbing effect on EU residents here. Some are going for UK citizenship others would not have it at any price. A great many have started making plans to leave. That is not only individiuals but people (inc Brits) who have established businesses and are significant employers.

As ever with the popular press & TV such incidents are given a great deal of prominence in the EU. Taken with the extremely negative attitude from no.10 downwards I would not rate the UK chances of getting any kind of deal out of the EU very highly and certainly not the current wish list.

The EU can take a hit on lost exports to the UK. German car firms have been told by Berlin not to expect any special deal - the EU 4 pillars take precedence. Look at the pickle Switzerland is in if you want proof of intention.

The UK, whatever Davis & co. may think, is not in n a position to lose out heavily on EU trade inc finance and services. The idea that the slack can be taken up by increased trade with the old Commonwealth and Asia is fantasy. Nearly all the major companies in the UK are foreign owned and the Single Market is key to their operations.

There are those who would point at recent trade figures and say that everything in the garden is rosy. Not at all.

Right now we remain full EU members ( a point which seems to have escaped the Daily Express ) and business has taken advantage of a weaker poiund. OTOH quite soon you will see sig price increases in the supermarket.

In the long run business deals don't happen in weeks but can take anything from a few months to several years ( eg jet engines ) to come to fruition. Such future business inc construction is already under the hammer as firms hang back and await developments.

T May cannot square the circle. If she wants immigration control as top priority then the result will be a country much poorer in every way. Refusing to allow parliament or the wider electorate any say on the brexit deal before it is implemented is both foolish and dangerous.

Caroline should stick to facts not fantasy.
Steptoe's horse and cart may be closer to current reality than her current icon.

Just trying to balance the discussion.

Neither conservative (small c) nor liberal (small l) publications have a monoploy for being 'correct'.

Although not disputing the statistics, it was interesting to read how or why the crimes were catagorised. I did wonder if there had been a rise in reported 'Hate Crimes' after the Nice 14 July attack.

Interesting article, although coming from the Spectator one would expect a Conservative right wing bias.

The writer gives his bias away in the last paragraph by referring to a "leftie" magazine, so I'll help myself to a tonne of salt.

Thanks Det that was a very interesting read.

Certainly sheds light on the way the force are dealing with reports.

Sue

A different perspective

http://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/08/the-real-hate-crime-scandal/

Can anyone find a breakdown based on Origins, Sexual orientation or Faith?

Recorded statistics are always more reliable than anecdotal evidence.- that's why they are officially recorded rather than randomly asking passing police officers.

If you don't want to believe the evidence that's up to you, and maybe the earth is flat, some people believe that as well.

Well we beg to differ and with serving police officers in my family I can only tell what I'm told.

Brexit is not to blame, those that may commit hate crimes have always done it and would have done it without the vote. Again not all of those that voted Brexit are bigots.

No, you're wrong.

Police have to record hate crimes all year round. They can't pick and choose when to do it, they are compelled to do it all the time.

The figures speak for themselves. Racism and hate crimes are on the up. And increased dramatically after the vote. That's a fact.

police figures like all stats tell the story they want told.

we all know there are times when certain crimes are more on the radar than others maybe they were just looking out for more hate crime after the vote because they expected it..just a thought...

just like they make more of an effort to catch drunk drivers at certain times of the year

No one wants to believe the police figures?

If you read the article no one said they did it because of Brexit but the statistics speak for themselves. Hate crime was up, or does anyone think the police were lying?

I'm talking about the rise in racial hate crime after the referendum not what happened in Essex. That has yet to be decided.

yes and they would probably have hit anyone for any reason, wrong colour of hair...wrong football team.....did they mean to kill him with that hit probably not.

What the stats cannot quantify is the number of attacks made by idiots who had the racist card hidden and used Brexit as an excuse to justify their actions. The ages of the reported crimes does not equate to 15 year olds.

That was my point! I would imagine these murderous thugs would have chosen any victim who was vulnerable to an attack. He happened to be Polish. Until the evidence by independent witnesses is heard it's all speculation.

The only proven fact is these yobs murdered someone and they got bailed!

And how much was actually proven crime and not just people blaming brexit.....it happens

Statistics can be used to prove anything you want to prove.

Statistics prove that most people are dead.