General Chat

Helena & Minnie in 1911

Minnie Tanner
Age in 1911: 39
Estimated birth year: abt 1872
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Battersea, Surrey, England
Civil Parish: Wandsworth
Search Photos: Search for 'Wandsworth' in the UK City, Town and Village Photos collection
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address: 191 Earlsfield Road, Wandsworth S W
Marital status: Single
Occupation: GLOVER MAKER
Registration district: Wandsworth
Registration District Number: 26
Sub-registration district: Sprinfield
ED, institution, or vessel: 14
Piece: 2383
Household Members:
Name Age
Minnie Tanner 39
Helena Wright 42 - sister, widowed
Maria Scott 21 - Boarder, single
Sarah Horne 53 - Lodger, widow
William Herbert 40 - Brother, single
Dorothy Herbert 14 - Neice
Stanley Cair 10 - Nurse child ie Foster child

One take regarding the Horne & Herberts is that Sarah Horne had a maiden name of Herbert. The relationship 'should' have been in reference to the head of the household in this case Minnie Tanner.

Although there are a couple of Wright/Tanner births on the GRO, its difficult to say if they are Helena's children. In all likelihood, probably not.

Probate for Helena F Wright nee Tanner

Name: Helena Fanny Wright
[Helena Wright]
Death Date: 8 May 1942
Death Place: Devonshire, England
Probate Date: 16 May 1947
Probate Registry: London, England

Wright, Helena Fanny otherwise Helena of The Hollies Woodlands Combe Martin Devon widow died 3 May 1942 at The Tuck Shop King-street Coombe Martin Administration (Limited) London 16 May to Alfred Harvey Doncaster retired school master attorney to Lillian Elizabeth Wagner. £971 8s 11d

Alfred H Doncaster acted as attorney for both letters of administration. He did so on behalf of Lillian Elizabeth Wagner, wife of Raymond Earl Wagner.

Who the heck was Lillian E Wagner? A Tanner/Wright relative or a friend?
......
North Devon Journal 07 May 1942
Mrs Helena Wright, an evacuee staying at The Hollies, Woodlands, Coombe Martin left her residenc about 6 o’clock on Sunday evening to attend the service in the Baptist Church. She was taken ill near Kingston Avenue and was assisted into the shop of Mr A Treweek but died before the arrival of Dr Probyn Williams (The coroner was satisfied concerning the cause of death)

Thank you for all your help. This is all valuable information.

Got them, possibly

U.S., Social Security Applications and Claims Index, 1936-2007
Earl Raymond Wagner
[Earl R Wagner]
Gender: Male
Race: White
Birth Date: 17 Jun 1917
Birth Place: Canton, Ohio
Death Date: 18 Dec 1998
Father: Raymond E Wagner
Mother: Lillian E Tanner
SSN: 287038582
Notes: Dec 1936: Name listed as EARL RAYMOND WAGNER; 05 Jan 1999: Name listed as EARL R WAGNER

Could Lillian Elizabeth (Wagner) have been the niece of the 2 ladies?

TANNER, LILY ELIZABETH mmn KENDALL
GRO Reference: 1896 S Quarter in HACKNEY Volume 01B Page 43

If you wanted to purchase a copy of the Letters of Administration, in the hope that they'll explain the relationship, use this official site.

https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/#wills

A copy would be emailed to you at a cost of £10 each.All major credit & debit cards accepted. The £10 would be converted to USD by the card provider.

As Helena was the last to die, hers would be the most relevant.

from FMP

Ohio Deaths, 1959-2012

First name(s) Earl R
Last name Wagner
Age 81
Gender Male
Birth year 1917
Birth month Jun
Death year 1998
Death day 18
Death month Dec
Death county Stark
Residence state Ohio
Father's last name Wagner
Mother's last name Tanner
State file number 101757
Country United States
Record set Ohio Deaths, 1959-2012
Category Life Events (BDMs)
Subcategory Civil Deaths & Burials
Collections from Americas, United States

1920 US Census

Raymond Wagner Self Married Male 24 1896 Ohio
Lillian Wagner Wife Married Female 24 1896 England
Earl Wagner Son Single Male 2 1918 Ohio

from image:-

Address:- 2716 Grove Place
Raymond's parents were both born in Germany, but he was born in Ohio
Raymond's occupation:- Pattern Maker in a factory.


1940 US Census

Raymond Wagner Head Married Male 42 1898 Ohio
Lillian Wagner Wife Married Female 42 1898 England

Raymond Wagner's Census Details

First name(s) Raymond
Last name Wagner
Relationship Head
Marital Status Married
Gender Male
Age 42
Birth year 1898
Birth place Ohio
Ethnicity American
Race White
City/township Detroit
County Wayne
State Michigan
Previous residence date 1935
Previous residence city Massillon
Previous residence county Stark

Lillian Wagner's Census Details

First name(s) Lillian
Last name Wagner
Relationship Wife
Marital Status Married
Gender Female
Age 42
Birth year 1898
Birth place England
Ethnicity American
Race White
City/township Detroit
County Wayne
State Michigan
Previous residence date 1935
Previous residence city Massillon
Previous residence county Stark

???????????????

National School Admission Registers & Log-Books 1870-1914

First name(s) Lily Eliz
Last name Tanner
Birth year 1896
Birth date 03 Jul 1896
Event year 1899
School name Boston Road Infants School
Town Croydon
County Surrey
Country England
Parent name(s) Sidney <<<<<<<<<<<<
Book type Admissions
Archive reference SCH144_2_1
Folio / page no. -
Archive
Croydon Archives
Record set National School Admission Registers & Log-Books 1870-1914
Category Education & work
Subcategory Schools & Education

Address:- 3 Colvin Road
Not been to school before

Sidney appears to have become Samuel in the US!! Everything else fits!!!

1920 US Census

Samuel Tanner Self Married Male 50 1870 England, Contractor, Brick Layer
Elizabeth Tanner Wife Married Female 46 1874 England
Elsie Tanner Daughter Single Female 20 1900 England
Albert Tanner Son Single Male 19 1901 England
Victor Tanner Son Single Male 13 1907 England
Minnie Tanner Daughter Single Female 12 1908 England
Bruce Tanner Son Single Male 9 1911 Ohio
Walter Tanner Son Single Male 3 1917 Ohio

Address:- 1143 Honsel (??sp) Dr S.E.

Samuel immigrated into the US in 1908, others (except Bruce and Watler) immigrated in 1911 (so they say!)

Full transcript of Victor's marriage from FMP explains all!

United States Marriages

First name(s) Victor J
Last name Tanner
Sex Male
Age 19
Birth year 1905
Father's first name(s) Sam
Father's last name Tanner
Mother's first name(s) Elizabeth
Mother's last name Randall
Event Marriage
Year 1924
Event date 25 Oct 1924
Location -
Place Lawrence, Ohio, United States
County Lawrence
State Ohio
Country United States
Spouse's first name(s) Edith Ramey
Spouse's last name Hulbert
Spouse's sex Female
Spouse's age 20
Spouse's birth year 1904
Spouse's father's first name(s) Elmer R
Spouse's father's last name Hulbert
Spouse's mother's first name(s) Florence
Spouse's mother's last name Tyrie <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
FamilySearch film number 001574148
Record set United States Marriages
Category Life Events (BDMs)
Subcategory Civil Marriage & Divorce
Collections from Americas, United States

Florence's surname on the image is hard to read but it looks more like Tyvie, and the T could be an F

So ............... Edith seems to have been born before Florence married Elmer Hulbert

Edith with her parents in the 1920 US census

1920 US Census

Richard Hulbert Self Married Male 33 1887 Minnesota
Florence Hulbert Wife Married Female 33 1887 Kentucky
Edith Hulbert Daughter Single Female 15 1905 Kentucky


Richard and Florence were married in 1909 ..........

United States Marriages

First name(s) Florence
Last name Fyvie
Sex Female
Age 23
Birth year 1886
Father's first name(s) W.W.
Father's last name Fyvie
Mother's first name(s) -
Mother's last name Dk
Event Marriage
Year 1909
Event date 26 May 1909
Location -
Place , Boyd, Kentucky, United States
County Boyd
State Kentucky
Country United States
Spouse's first name(s) Richard V.
Spouse's last name Hulbert
Spouse's sex Male
Spouse's marital status Married
Spouse's age 22
Spouse's birth year 1887
Spouse's father's first name(s) Emory
Spouse's father's last name Holbert
Spouse's mother's first name(s) Levina
Spouse's mother's last name Paterlds?
FamilySearch film number 002116495
Record set United States Marriages


Note that Richard says his father was Emory Hulbert, while Edith seemingly gets confused on HER marriage and says that her grandfather is her father!!!!