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No you're right Ivy. I looked at that and the image reads 32, not 52 as shown on the transcription.

So his birth year should be c1829 as you said.

Thanks Christina - I was worried I was going off at a tangent (still might be of course with the surname!)

Hi Christina,

Apologies, logged off last night before your posting. That's a point, I wonder if there is anything on Black Sheep?

There does seem to be a general move away from the Cosgriff name as the century moves on - I'm not sure whether it was just more females being born, or absorption into Cosgrave names, but there seem to be very few from Surrey, so I'm struggling to find Thomas sen'r in 1841/1851 as Cosgr*. On the other hand, there are a couple of possibles for Thomas Mansfield.

On a slightly more positive note, there is a birth registration for Thomas J Cosgriff in Lambeth about the right date:

Name: Thomas James Cosgriff
Year of Registration: 1852
Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
District: Lambeth
County: Greater London, London, Surrey
Volume: 1d
Page: 285

birth
Thomas James Cosgriff 1852 Jan-Feb-Mar Lambeth Greater London, London, Surrey

This is very confusing - No i'm just going to start with his brothers to see where that may lead.

It seems each line of my family I've tried are difficult ones!!

Thanks to you all for looking.

Karen

Black Sheep?

Can't find trace of siblings either - perhaps they were
Cosgriffs? and changed to Mansfield once father had died???

Hi Karen,

I couldn't find (either) George at all, but it looks like Edward stayed in the area and married a Louisa (as Mansfield).

I do worry that the Cosgriff apparent link might be entirely spurious...

I've not used the Black Sheep index before, and this prompted me to have a look - it seems it is a list of newspaper references and police records concerning newsworthy events - and, as ever, crime tends to top the list! No Cosgriffs listed, though.

- I think this is the site I've seen mentioned previously:

http://www.blacksheepindex.co.uk/

Rootsweb does mention Cosgriff and Mansfield - a marriage in Newington in 1824 between Timothy Cosgriff and Charlotte Mansfield - source is IGI:

Batch no M055631, 23 MAY 1824 Saint Mary, Newington, Surrey, England

Rootsweb page ref is:

http://tinyurl.com/2o7bg3

There is a birth registration as follows:

Births Dec 1851

MANSFIELD Thomas Bermondsey Vol 4 Page 24

According to the Atlas Bermondsey is only a couple or so miles away from Lambeth ....a possibility? Have a look and see what you think

I've found Thomas' son Thomas born 1881 military record he died 1917, all it states he was born Lambeth. The actual records I can't see - have some of these not been released yet? Or can they be requested? As these may well say next of kin.

Hi Karen,

Is this your Thomas on the CWGC site?

http://www.cwgc.org/search/casualty_details.aspx?casualty=86777

Hi Ivy

Yes that's him. I thought his details would give more details - perhaps of birth etc, which may of helped to find his father Thomas

Hi Ivy.

I never can get that roots site to work for me - i must be doing my searches wrong somehow!!

I'm not sure how this Cosgriff/Mansfield is working. I found in the 1861 Ellen, Thomas, George and Thomas with all very similar dates of birth to the Mansfields. Do you think possibly that Thomas Cosgriff died and Ellen married a Mansfield? and the children took the name Mansfield. On the son Thomas' wedding Cert to Eliza Young is does say Thomas Mansfield Father Deceased?