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I am trying to find out where my Great Granddad John "Thomas" Hibbert was born. He was born in 1864 (according to his marriage & death certs).

I have lots of info on his life from 1902 onwards but my family do not know where he was born.

Here is the info I have:

He married my Great Grandmother Martha Jane Binkley, previously Baker (maiden name BATE) in 1913 at The Register Office, Wigan. His father is recorded as John Thomas Hibbert, Joiner (Journeyman).

Martha was born in Runcorn, Cheshire in 1869. Martha was first married to William Richard Baker in 1892.

Martha's children were:
Walter Bate Runcorn 1890, Ethel Baker Runcorn 1893, John Baker Bedford, Luton 1897, Alfred Butler Baker Wakefield, Yorkshire 1898, Herbert Binkley Baker Wakefield, Yorkshire 1900.

Martha & John Thomas's children were:
Beatrice 1902, Esther 1905, George 1907, Grace 1909 and Doris 1913 (all born near Wigan, Lancs).

John Thomas and Martha lived in the Ince, Platt Bridge, Abram and Pemberton areas of Wigan.
John Thomas worked as a Coal Miner from 1902 onwards.

Beatrice married Charles Stokes and remained in the Wigan area.
Esther married Walter Mather and remained in the Wigan area.
George's first marriage was to Doris Sumner.
He later married again to Mabel Constance (surname not known).
George later moved to Lancaster and worked as a Hospital Porter.

Any help or info would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Annette

Was he a bachelor on his wedding cert? If he was born 1864, he would have been 49 when he married in 1913, quite old for a first marriage. What was his occupation on the marriage cert? What was his address?

By the way, Martha was nee Bate, not Baker. Nee means born.

I can find several John Hibbert's in 1901 but none that really fit the bill.

I wondered whether Martha and John met in Yorkshire or in Lancashire. Martha's surname is given as Buker on Ancestry in 1901 and she is living in Normanton (part of the Wakefield district). Any Hibberts nearby?

(logging off now, sorry)

Name: Walter Buker
Age: 11
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1890
Relation: Son
Mother's Name: Martha J
Gender: Male
Where born: Runwin, Cheshire, England

Civil Parish: Normanton
Ecclesiastical parish: Normanton All Saints
Town: Normanton
County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status:

View Image

Registration district: Wakefield
Sub registration district: Normanton
ED, institution, or vessel: 7
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 194
Household Members:
Name Age
Alfred B Buker 2
Ethel Buker 7
Herbert Buker 1
John W Buker 4
Martha J Buker 30
Walter Buker 11

Right age and he is a colliery labourer below ground. Will see if I can find him an earlier census with his parents:

1901 England Census
about John Hibbert
Name: John Hibbert
Age: 37
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1864
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Mary
Gender: Male
Where born: Monk Bretton, Yorkshire, England

Civil Parish: Darfield
Ecclesiastical parish: Darfield All Saints
Town: Woodhall
County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View Image

Registration district: Barnsley
Sub registration district: Darfield
ED, institution, or vessel: 4
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 29
Household Members: Name Age
Alice M Hibbert 5
Amelia Hibbert 15
Ernest Hibbert 10
John Hibbert 37
Mary Hibbert 36
Thomas A Hibbert 3

Edit - forget this one; his father was William.

Struggling to find anything. You may need to wait for the 1911 census to find his POB.

Hi Potty,

Thanks for that, a shame it didn't work out. Maybe they did meet in Lancs then?

Thanks to you both for searching.

Info from marriage cert:
John Thomas Hibbert, Bachelor, Colliery Labourer (Below Ground).
Father; John Thomas Hibbert, Joiner (Journeyman)
Both living @ 5 Tetley Street, Bamfurlong, near Wigan.

I can trace their address from June 1902 when their first child was born.

I had found Martha (and family) on the 1901, could have met Thomas in Yorkshire or Lancashire. More likely to have been Yorkshire though; cannot find a reason why Martha would move to the Wigan area, with her family, without a partner?? Martha was originally from the Runcorn area.

I think there are 2 possible reasons for the late marriage:
1) John Thomas wasn't the bachelor he stated on the marriage cert and had been married before, or
2) They just never got round to getting married earlier.

I hope I don't have to wait for the 1911 census! Thanks again,
Annette

UPDATE JULY 2008:

I have now got a copy of the 1911 census which states that Thomas Hibbert was born in Durham.

Just to add to the mystery ... it is possible that John Thomas HIBBERT may have changed his name and I am now trying to link the name HIBBERT with Durham.

There is a Thomas BRINTON aged 25 on the 1881 census. He is living with his Mother Esther and Step Father - who is named Edward HIBBERT. They are living Durham.

On the 1861 he is listed as John Thomas BRINTON aged 6 months - parents Thomas George BRINTON / Esther BRINTON.

There are names which run in my HIBBERT family that are also in these HIBBERT / BRINTON families; Esther, Grace and George.

I have found both marriages for Esther:

1854 - Newcastle
Esther FAIRS & Thomas BRINTON

1863 - South Shields
Esther BRINTON & Edward HIBBERT

Any information or advice would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Annette

possible death of Thomas Brinton

Name: Thomas George Brinton
Year of Registration: 1862
Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
District: Gateshead
County: Durham, Tyne and Wear
Volume: 10a
Page: 337 (click to see others on page)

1861 England Census
about John T Brinton
Name: John T Brinton
Age: 6 Mo
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1860
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Thomas G
Mother's Name: Esther
Gender: Male
Where born: Gateshead, Durham, England

Civil Parish: Gateshead
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary
Town: Gateshead
County/Island: Durham
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View Image

Registration district: Gateshead
Sub registration district: Gateshead
ED, institution, or vessel: 9
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 137
Household Members: Name Age
Esther Brinton 26
John T Brinton 6 Mo
Joseph F Brinton 2
Thomas G Brinton 26
Mary Jane Hall 16
Jane Hoggins 18

birth of John Thomas Brinton Q4 1861 Gateshead
Vol 10a Page 511

1871 England Census
about Thomas Brinton
Name: Thomas Brinton
Age: 10
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1861
Relation: Son
Father's Name: Edward
Mother's Name: Esther
Gender: Male
Where born: Gateshead, Durham, England
Civil Parish: Harton
Ecclesiastical parish: St Peter
Town: Greenlaw
County/Island: Durham
Country: England
Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View Image
Registration district: South Shields
Sub registration district: Westoe
ED, institution, or vessel: 28
Household schedule number: 86
Household Members: Name Age
Thomas Brinton 10
Alfred Hubbert 2
Grace Hubbert 7
William E Hubbert 5
Edward Hubby 35
Esther Hubby 37

1891 England Census
about John L Brinton
Name: John L Brinton
Age: 30
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1861
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Catherine
Gender: Male
Where born: Gateshead, Durham, England

Civil Parish: Harton
Ecclesiastical parish: St. Simon
Town: Harton
County/Island: Durham
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: coal (fitter?)

Registration district: South Shields
Sub registration district: Westoe
ED, institution, or vessel: 52b
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Catherine Brinton 20
Christina Brinton 9
Grace H Brinton 1
John L Brinton 30
John T Brinton 4


Image has John T Brinton
Catherine's age is 30

Marriages Jun 1881 (>99%)

BRINTON John Thomas S. Shields 10a 966 TODD Catherine S. Shields 10a 966

Jeanette,

Thanks, thats really helpful.

Regards,
Annette

1901 England Census
about Catharine Brinton
Name: Catharine Brinton
Age: 39
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1862
Relation: Pauper
Gender: Female
Where born: Newcastle, Northumberland, England

Civil Parish: Harton
Ecclesiastical parish: Harton All Saints
County/Island: Durham
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View Image

Registration district: South Shields
Sub registration district: South Shields
ED, institution, or vessel: South Shields Union Workhouse
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 1

1901 England Census
about Grace Brinton
Name: Grace Brinton
Age: 10
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1891
Relation: Pauper
Gender: Female
Where born: Harton, Durham, England

Civil Parish: Harton
Ecclesiastical parish: Harton All Saints
County/Island: Durham
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View Image

Registration district: South Shields
Sub registration district: South Shields
ED, institution, or vessel: South Shields Union Workhouse
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 1

Can't find anything on census to match John Thomas, Christina or John Jnr yet.

Jeanette,

Thanks again!

I couldn't find John T on the 1901, the census you have found with Catherine a pauper in the workhouse explains that.

There is only one Thomas Brinton living in Durham on the 1901 and hee was born in Ireland.

He must have died between 1891 and 1901 but I can't find a death record to match.

Annette

I couldn't find a death either.

Perhaps the family have split up and John Thomas has changed his name to Hibbert?

I have found these marriages though

Year of Registration: 1891
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
District: Gateshead
County: Durham, Tyne and Wear
Volume: 10a 1206


Ellen Dean
Harrison Green
Elizabeth Henderson
John Thomas Hibbert


edit

found Harrison Green & wife Elizabeth on 1901 census.Mary Henderson SIL with them.

Looks like John Thomas Hibbert married Ellen Dean

was father recorded as deaceased on Martha & John's marriage certificate?

Jeanette,

Yes, he was recorded as deceased when they married in 1913.

Annette